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Show HN: Ladder, find a new startup job anonymously

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Re: Show HN: Ladder, find a new startup job anonymously

#31

Post by jnbiche »

ForHackernews wrote: post #26
danielweber wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

About a week ago it occurred to me that "Full Stack Developer" is what we used to call "Software Engineer." It's like suddenly understanding some idiom the locals are using; everything in the universe made a lot more sense.

Is that true? I always took "Full Stack Developer" to mean "We're too cheap to hire a proper ops team, so we're going to expect you to serve triple-duty as Sysadmin, DBA, and Software Developer." Maybe I've been unfairly ignoring a lot of postings?

>"...we're going to expect you to serve triple-duty as Sysadmin, DBA, and Software Developer." >Maybe I've been unfairly ignoring a lot of postings?

If that's your impression, then I think you have been. By full-stack developer, many people in the start-up world simply mean someone who can work at all levels of web development, from server-side programming to Javascript, CSS, and HTML.

It's not an unreasonable use of the word, since web developers have long talked of "their stack", meaning what they use for server-side framework, caching, http server, as well as client-side frameworks and development environments.

I don't think most people use the term to include sysops, although in a small start-up you will inevitably be doing a lot of that.

Re: Show HN: Ladder, find a new startup job anonymously

#33

Post by ForHackernews »

jnbiche wrote: post #31
ForHackernews wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is that true? I always took "Full Stack Developer" to mean "We're too cheap to hire a proper ops team, so we're going to expect you to serve triple-duty as Sysadmin, DBA, and Software Developer." Maybe I've been unfairly ignoring a lot of postings?

>"...we're going to expect you to serve triple-duty as Sysadmin, DBA, and Software Developer." >Maybe I've been unfairly ignoring a lot of postings? If that's your impression, then I think you have been. By full-stack developer, many people in the start-up world simply mean someone who can work at all levels of web development, from server-side programming to Javascript, CSS, and HTML. It's not an unreasonable use of…

> web developers have long talked of "their stack", meaning what they use for server-side framework, caching, http server, as well as client-side frameworks and development environments.

I guess I would consider the http/app/caching servers to be properly the province of sysops.

As a web developer, I consider myself to be responsible for server-side code/frameworks, database schemas (but not DB installation/configuration/replication), and perhaps client-side HTML/JS/CSS.

I'm capable of installing and doing basic setup for things like nginx, varnish, and uWSGI or passenger, but I find it frustrating and I'm certainly no expert in configuring for ideal performance.

Re: Show HN: Ladder, find a new startup job anonymously

#35

Post by frankdenbow »

brackin wrote: post #6
eroo wrote: post #3

If you wouldn't mind providing some insight, I'm curious what your approach is to verifying a hire is w.r.t. collecting commission?

We want to get out of the way as much as possible. We're really involved with companies and check back in. Can check Linkedin, etc. We wait to see how the employee fits within the company. If we connect companies with high quality hires they'll want to pay so that they can continue working with us. This will likely only scale to a certain size.

Thats the hardest part. I built something similar, although not anonymous (http://startupjob.me) and collecting is tough.

What I have been trying is incentivizing the candidate to also check back in if they have been hired. That way you don't have to rely on the companies alone.

Re: Show HN: Ladder, find a new startup job anonymously

#36

Post by lauradhamilton »

brackin wrote: post #8
pauldino wrote: post #7

Was there any concern about a trademark conflict with TheLadders?

It's a different market & a generic term used in hiring (this is only for tech talent & curated approach), the name isn't that important though.

IANAL but I agree that there does seem to be a conflict with http://www.theladders.com/

Re: Show HN: Ladder, find a new startup job anonymously

#38

Post by 7Figures2Commas »

taariqlewis wrote: post #18

A very busy space. The true demand is that you have lots of passive talent signing up. These folks are highly valued, but it's not clear how you get passive seekers (who aren't interested in moving unless they get excited) to make a change. Active seekers are already in the ATS' of ALL your recruiting companies. They aren't that valuable. So, you have lots to do here. Your competitors at Hired.com and elsewhere are i…

The "passive seekers" you refer to are what I like to call window shoppers.

Recruiting platforms like this one almost always appeal to window shoppers. Many window shoppers are folks who simply want find out if the grass is greener on the other side. In most cases they're window shopping because they don't really know what they want and they're not motivated enough to figure it out. For example, many of these folks are not looking to work in a particular vertical, or to solve a particular type of technical challenge. Instead, they're looking to see if they can earn $xx,xxx more per year or get into a hotter startup.

I wouldn't say that there are no good window shoppers, but they're rarely as attractive as the folks who are happily employed but open-minded enough to explore a great opportunity if they encounter one. Non-window shoppers are more likely to be people you meet in person. You pique their interest by telling a compelling story about your business or the technical challenges you're trying to solve, not by leading with compensation and your fridge's awesome collection of imported beers.

It's amusing that so many companies don't see these networks of window shoppers for what they are.

Re: Show HN: Ladder, find a new startup job anonymously

#39

Post by brackin »

fiatjaf wrote: post #37
brackin wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Made that clearer on the homepage now, just their first year.

Still high, but at least saner.

Most of the other marketplaces people have mentioned in this thread charge 2-4X more than us. If we can connect companies with great talent it'll be worth it.

Re: Show HN: Ladder, find a new startup job anonymously

#40

Post by notduncansmith »

kurrent wrote: post #25
dyadic wrote: post #17

I really dislike the use of "Full Stack Developer" and especially when I'm pushed into that box by the only other choices being FE and iOS dev.

where does one fall in their list of choices if they are doing backend/server side code? http://i.imgur.com/h20L66f.jpg there seems to be no clear choice for that

There's really very little excuse for not knowing enough front-end stuff to consider yourself a "full-stack web developer".

HTML/CSS are easy-peasy, and while some people don't like Javascript, it's hard to get away from and you can only increase your value as a developer by being able to work with it. Add to that a little bit of client-side tooling knowledge (Gulp, SCSS/LESS), and some familiarity with jQuery and you're good to go. Shouldn't take more than a week tops to get the hang of it all; no-one's saying you have to be a wizard.

You don't have to love front-end work (I enjoy it, but I also really like doing back-end work so I understand both perspectives), but you're doing yourself and anyone who employs you a disservice by not being at least a somewhat-solid front-end dev. Early-stage startups don't really have room for people without that level of versatility. If you're going to write code, you should be able to write front-end code, back-end code, and be able to administrate your startup's servers to some degree. If you can only do front-end, you'd better be at least a decent designer. If you can only do backend, you ought to be doing some kick-ass ops work. The phrase "T-shaped individual" comes to mind.

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