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Google is Breaking the Internet

jeremypalmer.com

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Re: Google is Breaking the Internet

#131

Post by jonknee »

PavlovsCat wrote: post #114
jonknee wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it's not our perogative to link the way Google us to. Who said it was? Google didn't ask him to do anything. A random person on the internet did. I frequently get emails from random people on the internet who ask all sorts of insanely idiotic things that have little basis in reality.

Did you even read the article? > Apparently Google convinced them, via their Webmaster Tools portal, that the link looked “unnatural”, and that they should use the Link Disavow Tool to discredit the link.

Yes and that's exactly my point. The email doesn't mention anything about Google, it just says they are cleaning up their links and if it's not a big deal please delete the links on your site. This isn't uncommon, just like it's not uncommon to get emails soliciting links.

The OP has come up with a theory about the backstory and then used that theory to blame Google for ruining the internet (ignoring the fact that the entire "credit" he wants is Google's invention in the first place).

Re: Google is Breaking the Internet

#132

Post by magicalist »

noir_lord wrote: post #106
newaccountfool wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think this is pretty common, if you want a website to rank. Then rank it as best as you can then smash the other websites with shitty, unnatural links. Pretty good idea actually but if it continues then it creates a really bad environment for search engines.

Not just a good idea this is actually done already by the blackhat guys, they also use the same technique to extort you in the classic "nice website rankings you have here, be a shame if anything happened to them" manner.

The disavowal tool really isn't that hard to use. Yes, it is more work than no work, but if you depend on a search engine for traffic, you're going to have to do some work to optimize for it (like, sign up for webmaster tools).

Re: Google is Breaking the Internet

#133

Post by ZenPro »

guiambros wrote: post #16
sbierwagen wrote: post #2

Jeremy Palmer is a SEO marketer, who also appears to be doing some scammy affiliate thing. Google considers his links low quality because they are low quality.

The letter from the company asking to remove the links reveal they used a shady SEO company to generate artificial inbound links. Not a surprise that Google got some false positives -- particularly coming from a SEO blog. Not really "breaking the internet".

It pretty much is if organic hyperlinks become feared entities.

No hyperlinks = no internet.

Re: Google is Breaking the Internet

#134

Post by ForHackernews »

EGreg wrote: post #115
Matt_Cutts wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"If the wrong sorts of sites (however defined), sites outside my control, are linking to my site, why am I penalized, and why should the burden be placed on me to go fix it?" Well, if a website was link spamming then it seems appropriate that the site should attempt to clean up the spam they made before they can rank well in Google again. Otherwise it's not fair to the other websites that have been trying to rank fai…

What Matt Cutts is saying, is that as collectively smart as his employer Google is, they aren't able to always figure out if a link is natural and when it's "paid for" as part of linkspam. If they could, they would obviously put that in their algorithm. Matt Cutts' job at Google involves him making tons of videos explaining how the Google algorithm works. It isn't omniscient, and the guidelines show how to work withi…

> Google's customers are its users.

No, Google's customers are its advertisers. They're the ones who pay money to Google.

I agree with your general point though, the algorithm isn't perfect and sometimes it goofs. What I think people are having a negative reaction to is Matt Cutts' seemingly obtuse responses, as though he doesn't even understand the issue at hand (Google's actions distorting natural behavior), so he just keeps explaining the anti-spam policies in general terms. It's not a conversation, it's people talking past one another.

Re: Google is Breaking the Internet

#135

Post by patrickmay »

EGreg wrote: post #115
Matt_Cutts wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"If the wrong sorts of sites (however defined), sites outside my control, are linking to my site, why am I penalized, and why should the burden be placed on me to go fix it?" Well, if a website was link spamming then it seems appropriate that the site should attempt to clean up the spam they made before they can rank well in Google again. Otherwise it's not fair to the other websites that have been trying to rank fai…

What Matt Cutts is saying, is that as collectively smart as his employer Google is, they aren't able to always figure out if a link is natural and when it's "paid for" as part of linkspam. If they could, they would obviously put that in their algorithm. Matt Cutts' job at Google involves him making tons of videos explaining how the Google algorithm works. It isn't omniscient, and the guidelines show how to work withi…

> Google's customers are its users.

No, Google's customers are primarily its advertisers. Optimizing advertising revenue has some overlap with pleasing users, as you note, but if a decision needed to be made between pleasing users and increasing revenue, there's no doubt about which way it would go.

Re: Google is Breaking the Internet

#136

Post by eddie_catflap »

I get a regular drip feed of these requests. Depending on my mood I check the outgoing link. Usually it's from someone recommending the service or product that the site asking me to remove the link offers. I've mailed quite a few of the requestors back. I explain that I've set all links to be nofollow and that it was a real person that created the link. Only 1 person has ever understood this. The rest all demanded the link still be removed with varying degrees of politeness. I just don't think site owners get it and to echo several comments here perhaps Google could make some clearer instructions about what they want.

Re: Google is Breaking the Internet

#137

Post by Silhouette »

jonknee wrote: post #24

> Site owners and publishers are now afraid to link to each other because they don’t know how Google might respond to that link. For example, Wikipedia and the New York Times have added the “nofollow" attribute to most of the links outside of their editorial control. I'm a little confused why he cares about nofollow links--if Google doesn't "own" the internet, what does nofollow matter? It's certainly better than not…

Furthermore, the "credit" he so desperately wants publishers to receive is only a thing because of Google Page Rank in the first place.

That makes no sense. Citing an original source, such as an article that inspired your own work or with relevant background for ideas you're building on, is common courtesy in any field, and it's directly useful to your readers in the Web case.

Amazing as some people apparently find it, it is still quite possible to "surf" the web, following links from site to site without relying on a search engine like Google to find anything interesting or useful. The fact that Google appear to be promoting policies that could threaten to this alternative is rather the point here.

Re: Google is Breaking the Internet

#138

Post by nivla »

ronnier wrote: post #118
ggreer wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could you please tell us your hosting provider and the website that sent the DMCA notice? I'd like to avoid both of them, if I can.

This was the link: https://news.ycombinator.com/submitted?id=jayjay1010 http://linkaudit.co.uk/ Which I've blocked: http://ihackernews.com/by/jayjay1010 My host is Softsys hosting. http://www.softsyshosting.com

Ohh the irony of them being a "Link removing service". I wonder how it would have affected the credibility & guarantee of their service had you told them no.

Re: Google is Breaking the Internet

#139

Post by jonknee »

ForHackernews wrote: post #129
jonknee wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You emphasized Google, but you should have emphasized apparently , because nowhere in the actual email is the OP's conspiracy theory about Google mentioned (or even the word Google!). It's quite likely they noticed a penalty and are just going through all their back links to find shady content.

Sure, this is all hearsay and second- and third-hand information, and the article is really sparse on details. > It's quite likely they noticed a penalty... Yes, and where would they have noticed that penalty?

> Yes, and where would they have noticed that penalty?

In a drop in incoming traffic, so with whatever they're using for analytics.

In all honesty it's probably just a new SEO consultant trying to clean up past sins and move on with whatever the latest grey hat strategy is.

IMO it's a gross overreaction to a form letter that a high percentage of webmasters have received.

Re: Google is Breaking the Internet

#140

Post by DerpDerpDerp »

Matt_Cutts wrote: post #72
jamesbritt wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When SEOs break the quality guidelines of all major search engines (not just Google), then they might need to do some work to clean things up if they get caught. This still seems to be missing the point. As I understand it, sites that are not doing anything in the realm of SEO can get penalized because of the actions of people outside of their control. If the wrong sorts of sites (however defined), sites outside my c…

"If the wrong sorts of sites (however defined), sites outside my control, are linking to my site, why am I penalized, and why should the burden be placed on me to go fix it?" Well, if a website was link spamming then it seems appropriate that the site should attempt to clean up the spam they made before they can rank well in Google again. Otherwise it's not fair to the other websites that have been trying to rank fai…

Your comments on this post are a great demonstration of the attitude that is driving me off Google properties, as quickly as I can find viable replacements.
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