TLDR: Market share > Principles > We have come to the point where Mozilla not implementing the W3C EME specification means that Firefox users have to switch to other browsers to watch content restricted by DRM.
Time for a fork.
Can This Web Be Saved? Mozilla Accepts DRM, and We All Lose
251–260 of 374 posts
Re: Can This Web Be Saved? Mozilla Accepts DRM, and We All Lose
#252Mozilla had to be dragged into this acceptance kicking and screaming (metaphorically). They were faced with a hard choice, Not implement EME (HTML5 DRM) and risk users moving to other browsers (user loss) or implement EME and risk looking like they are contradicting their core mission (trust loss). They figured a little loss of trust is worth keeping most of the users on the Mozilla platform - which in my view is the…
By making that decision there is no reason left to keep using Firefox, since technically, Chrome is a superior browser.
Re: Can This Web Be Saved? Mozilla Accepts DRM, and We All Lose
#253DRM is a fantasy that uninformed media executives cling onto with a dream that it will put the genie back in the bottle. It's sad to see this stuff but totally understandable considering the divide between the technology people who understand the reality and the people in charge of dreaming of a fantasy that gets them back to the '80s.. Yes I know.. I was an executive as a major record label, trust me it's hard to be…
I'm wondering: what do you suggest to artists, how shall they make money on their work?
Re: Can This Web Be Saved? Mozilla Accepts DRM, and We All Lose
#254So I'm guessing that this will backfire. Mozilla say that Adobe will create the software, which will presumably be bundled with the browser. This means that if Adobe's DRM gets cracked, suddenly every site using that DRM is vulnerable. At the moment, one just updates the client to obfuscate a bit better, which is then downloaded on next launch of the software. If it's all client side, surely then the DRM will have to be updated every few days - which would be a nightmare for sysadmins etc.
Re: Can This Web Be Saved? Mozilla Accepts DRM, and We All Lose
#255Earlier quoted context omitted.
What would the web gain if Mozilla could just be pushed into chasing whatever Apple, Microsoft, and Google decide to do for fear of some users jumping ship? edit: Mozilla needs to cultivate its brand, and set itself apart from the other browsers through actual differences in philosophy. Maybe they need a John Legere...
Mozilla has been different in philosophy. It's the only browser created by a nonprofit, and it fights for open web causes all the time. I think people that care about that are aware of it. But the facts remain that the vast majority of users don't care about the philosophical differences. When Chrome and Internet Explorer started shipping EME, almost no one switched browser. When Snowden's revelations came out, almos…
Anybody taking Snowden's revelations seriously would switch to Chrome or another Chromium build. The leaks contained information on exploited vulnerabilities in Firefox. Chrome's sandboxing makes it a safer browser than Firefox.
This is opposite the choice somebody would make if they were philosophically opposed to DRM.
Re: Can This Web Be Saved? Mozilla Accepts DRM, and We All Lose
#256[deleted]
Re: Can This Web Be Saved? Mozilla Accepts DRM, and We All Lose
#257Earlier quoted context omitted.
> If HTML5 video is going to rely on buggy third party DRM plugins, we lose the benefit that was the whole point of HTML5 video Only HTML5 video that has DRM will rely on EME plugins. We've lost nothing. In fact we've gained. HTML5 video now has a strict superset of the capabilities it had before. Without EME: Flash HTML5 +------+--------+ non-DRM video | yes | yes | +------+--------+ DRM video | yes | no | +------+-…
All video will now have DRM. We have lost video that did not have DRM. It will now be almost as easy to implement video with DRM in production as it is to implement HTML5 video without DRM. Every provider will now use DRM. Netflix will use fancy DRM, which mostly works. Everyone else will pay $19.95 for theirs. Never thought we were going to bring back the age of Realplayer (and the million others.)
> All video will now have DRM.
No, it won't.
> We have lost video that did not have DRM.
We may lose some because it may get easier to implement DRM and that may tip the balance for some content source.
> It will now be almost as easy to implement video with DRM in production as it is to implement HTML5 video without DRM.
But plenty of sources will still choose not to use DRM, as is the case even with other formats where DRM is well-estbalished as an option with simple toolchains.
Re: Can This Web Be Saved? Mozilla Accepts DRM, and We All Lose
#258Mozilla had to be dragged into this acceptance kicking and screaming (metaphorically). They were faced with a hard choice, Not implement EME (HTML5 DRM) and risk users moving to other browsers (user loss) or implement EME and risk looking like they are contradicting their core mission (trust loss). They figured a little loss of trust is worth keeping most of the users on the Mozilla platform - which in my view is the…
It might be the right choice, but it would be nice if somehow they displayed that the content displayed is protected by DRM (like for encryption, http/https). It might help people choose different sources for information/entertainment/etc..
Re: Can This Web Be Saved? Mozilla Accepts DRM, and We All Lose
#259Re: Can This Web Be Saved? Mozilla Accepts DRM, and We All Lose
#260Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Perhaps the whole existence of Mozilla was leading up to this point where it could commit ritualistic suicide and take this DRM proposal with it. Except, if Mozilla had committed "ritualistic suicide" over EME, it wouldn't have taken EME with it. Users would move to every other browser with HTML5 DRM implemented, Mozilla would die accomplishing nothing. A world with entrenched HTML5 DRM & Mozilla strikes me as stri…
EFF is basically Walter Sobchack in this scenario to Mozilla's dude. EFF: Has the whole world gone crazy? Am I the only one around here who gives a shit about the open web? Dude. This is it. Let's take that hill! Mozilla: what's the point, man? why should I die on this hill? EFF: it's a fucking important hill dude. Unchecked DRM aggression. Mozilla: what about my browser market share? EFF: What the fuck are you talki…
Mozilla: Goddammit EFF, you fucking asshole. Everything's a fucking travesty with you man!
EFF: I'm sorry, it was an accident.
Mozilla: What was that shit about the open web? What the fuck does anything have to do with the open web?
EFF: Dude, I'm sorry...
Mozilla: What the fuck are you talking about?
EFF: Dude, I'm sorry...
Mozilla: Fucking... fuck, EFF.
EFF: Come on, dude. Hey, fuck it, man, let's go bowling.