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Project Ara – Google's modular phone project

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Re: Project Ara – Google's modular phone project

#131
post #93

Once upon a time, when I was younger, I felt very strongly that I needed a computer with everything replaceable. I wanted to replace a CPU when it got too slow, new graphics card, upgradable RAM, storage, etc. But I found that in the end while I'd make small upgrades, I still replaced my computers at close to the same rate. That because some standard that was built into the old machine was no longer fast enough or wi…

Google might benefit strategically from a market where phones are commoditized down at the hardware subsystem level. This would further disempower hardware integrators like Samsung. The analogy is Microsoft:beige box::Google:component phone.

I'm fairly certain this is the real goal of the project.

Re: Project Ara – Google's modular phone project

#132
post #87

People are viewing this project as a 'lego' phone that sounds great in theory but doesn't charm practically. However manufacturers can take a middle ground approach where future electronics slowly move towards hot swappable components. Upgrading & replacing defective parts shouldn't require a screw driver and perhaps as easy as plugging in a USB cable. When I'm buying a high end phone & spending $600, I'd want it to…

There are other models, like sell the razor cheap and charge more for the blades, which can support a product ecosystem, albeit a smaller one than that for grooming products.

Consider that the FOB price for replacement cellphone cameras is under $5 in quantities of $100. The hardware is cheap, the labor of installing it into a phone that needs repair is not. But if you make it user-installable (as here), you can sell the exact same camera for maybe $20-30, with only a minimal increase in the cost of production for the modular package. So this could work out quite nicely for component manufacturers by giving them a small additional revenue stream from enthusiast/hobby buyers.

All those people complaining that it won't be competitive with other phones for consumer dollars are totally missing the point. Of course consumers will continue to prefer all-in-one products from brand name manufacturers like Apple and Samsung, for the same reason that most consumers want a car that Just Works rather one that requires them to be an amateur mechanic.

And yet, there's a thriving retail business in auto parts, because a lot of people do like to hack on their cars or carry out their own repairs. And likewise, there's a market for modular phones among hackers, engineers, high school and college students, and all sorts of other niches, who want flexibility but don't necessarily want to go down the Arduino route with soldering and building their own cases and PCBs. Simple example: stick two camera modules into one of these things, and you have a super cheap 3d camera platform.

This will be absolutely huge in the developing world where utility >> convenience or aesthetics.

Re: Project Ara – Google's modular phone project

#133
post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the PC analogy is wrong. I also framing this as money saving option is wrong. The potential is in flexibility. Phones are small. Tradeoffs are substantial. Some people would prefer 50% more battery life at the expense of the camera or weight. Maybe someone can make an e-ink screen that will double battery life. Some people might want to spend $800 on the camera. IMO, that's the benefit. Commercially, I see th…

Perhaps, but (at least in Android) existing phone selection gives a pretty wide range of possibilities without incurring the drawbacks of the modular design. Admittedly, you can't buy a phone with high end CPU/memory/storage and low end screen, but I suspect there is a fair amount of predictability in what people will pair together. I think you find a lot of people who would buy a top of the line phone with everythin…

(at least in Android) existing phone selection gives a pretty wide range of possibilities

No, it doesn't. None of the following exist with an up-to-date version of Android (at least 4.3) and medium to high specs (comparable to a Moto X or better):

* A slider form-factor with a physical keyboard. I have one friend who keeps buying old phones to have that, and another who kept her Droid 4 until it broke despite the option of a free upgrade.

* Something roughly iPhone-sized; the Moto X and Sony Z1 Compact are small by Android flagship standards, but considerably wider than iPhones and hard for anyone with hands smaller than the average American male to use one-handed.

* A ruggedized design. I don't mean simply dust and waterproof like recent models from Samsung and Sony, but capable of withstanding significant abuse. Some cases partly compensate, but what I'm thinking of would probably require a thick layer of tempered glass over the screen and a digitizer intended to compensate for the reduction in sensitivity.

I know people who would buy each of these. I'm almost certain that a smartphone manufacturer outside of the top 3 that did a good job making any one of these three options would increase its profits significantly.

Re: Project Ara – Google's modular phone project

#134

I wish someone had done this for PCs 20 years ago.

Can you clarify what you mean? Maybe not 20, but 15 years ago my dad was mucking around in the guts of our family computer, performing his own upgrades. By the time we got rid of that thing the only original component was the case. And nowadays you can order any piece of hardware you want off the internet and slap it in.

Re: Project Ara – Google's modular phone project

#135
post #51

A musing about the aesthetic of modular: My first 21st century "gadget" (for some obviously arbitrary definition of the term) was an ipod nano. I'm not very sensitive to the niceness of things in general so I was pretty surprised at how much I liked how it looked and felt in my hands. It was, cold metallic, small, sleek and completely solid. It had no give in it at all and felt like a magic rock. The solidness of it…

You are the sort of person who would enjoy using modular synthesizers. * Not responsible for possible bankruptcy/ divorce/ loss of employment resulting from acting on above advice

Forum to pump that paycheck into:

http://www.muffwiggler.com/forum/

Re: Project Ara – Google's modular phone project

#136
post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps, but (at least in Android) existing phone selection gives a pretty wide range of possibilities without incurring the drawbacks of the modular design. Admittedly, you can't buy a phone with high end CPU/memory/storage and low end screen, but I suspect there is a fair amount of predictability in what people will pair together. I think you find a lot of people who would buy a top of the line phone with everythin…

(at least in Android) existing phone selection gives a pretty wide range of possibilities No, it doesn't. None of the following exist with an up-to-date version of Android (at least 4.3) and medium to high specs (comparable to a Moto X or better): * A slider form-factor with a physical keyboard. I have one friend who keeps buying old phones to have that, and another who kept her Droid 4 until it broke despite the opt…

I don't think a modular phone factor like shown here solves any of those problems though...

* A sliding keyboard requires pretty intense engineering within the body

* It seems ara is targeting very large and very small sizes, but not something like an iPhone. Even if it does, it doesn't solve the "I want a phone thats size X", it still limits your choice of size. Further, I wouldn't call this[0] "considerably wider".

* These phones are guaranteed to be much more fragile than current phones, that's a tradeoff of modularity.

So really, though I understand your desire, in the context of Project Ara all of these requirements are met better by current available smartphones.

[0] http://www.phonearena.com/phones/size/Sony-Xperia-Z1-Compact...

Re: Project Ara – Google's modular phone project

#137
post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the PC analogy is wrong. I also framing this as money saving option is wrong. The potential is in flexibility. Phones are small. Tradeoffs are substantial. Some people would prefer 50% more battery life at the expense of the camera or weight. Maybe someone can make an e-ink screen that will double battery life. Some people might want to spend $800 on the camera. IMO, that's the benefit. Commercially, I see th…

Perhaps, but (at least in Android) existing phone selection gives a pretty wide range of possibilities without incurring the drawbacks of the modular design. Admittedly, you can't buy a phone with high end CPU/memory/storage and low end screen, but I suspect there is a fair amount of predictability in what people will pair together. I think you find a lot of people who would buy a top of the line phone with everythin…

I agree on the high end CPU, low end screen combo. I don't mean living with a lower end screen to shave 7% off the price of a phone. I doubt this will ever offer that anyway.

I mean more unusual setups like a huge, expensive camera mic to try and turn a tablet into a portable recording editing thing. More sensors. Joysticks. Little feet or wheels and a laser pointer so that your not just stuck on your back when you're in a video call.

Re: Project Ara – Google's modular phone project

#138
post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps, but (at least in Android) existing phone selection gives a pretty wide range of possibilities without incurring the drawbacks of the modular design. Admittedly, you can't buy a phone with high end CPU/memory/storage and low end screen, but I suspect there is a fair amount of predictability in what people will pair together. I think you find a lot of people who would buy a top of the line phone with everythin…

I agree on the high end CPU, low end screen combo. I don't mean living with a lower end screen to shave 7% off the price of a phone. I doubt this will ever offer that anyway. I mean more unusual setups like a huge, expensive camera mic to try and turn a tablet into a portable recording editing thing. More sensors. Joysticks. Little feet or wheels and a laser pointer so that your not just stuck on your back when you'r…

I'll be the first person to admit if I'm wrong. I also think that if this product is made, there will be some cool use cases and users currently under-served that will find great benefits form the modular system, but I remain skeptical that there will be enough people positively impacted make up for the possible negatives.

Re: Project Ara – Google's modular phone project

#139
post #111

I'd actually love it if this idea extended far enough to let me double my "phone" as an impromptu laptop/desktop. I know that we can use a bluetooth keyboard or whatever and kind of simulate things. But I'd love to carry around a single computing device that I can drop into a cradle at home and it's using my two big desktop monitors and nice keyboard/mouse, and when out and about, head into a coffee shop and swap the…

I like the modularity idea, I don't know if I'd want to be swapping components five times a day though.

If the idea is just to have the same files/data on all your "different" devices, I think I like the idea of running a central fileserver with that stuff on it, and having separate phone, desktop, etc, that each do two or three things and do them well, and they all mount the fileserver, which has a much storage as you want, gets backed up regularly, is where indexing happens, is where long-running downloads happen. and everything mounting that gets the same files. oh, and a server is less likely to go missing or stolen or soaked.

Your idea is the simplest way to preserve application state between "different" devices, my idea is the best way to preserve saved-file state (and only that) between using different devices.

Your idea has been done to some extent by the Motorola Lapdock, but I don't actually know anything about it.

Re: Project Ara – Google's modular phone project

#140
post #111

I'd actually love it if this idea extended far enough to let me double my "phone" as an impromptu laptop/desktop. I know that we can use a bluetooth keyboard or whatever and kind of simulate things. But I'd love to carry around a single computing device that I can drop into a cradle at home and it's using my two big desktop monitors and nice keyboard/mouse, and when out and about, head into a coffee shop and swap the…

I like the modularity idea, I don't know if I'd want to be swapping components five times a day though. If the idea is just to have the same files/data on all your "different" devices, I think I like the idea of running a central fileserver with that stuff on it, and having separate phone, desktop, etc, that each do two or three things and do them well, and they all mount the fileserver, which has a much storage as y…

One of the problems of course with all this mode changing is that software has to support it. Look at all the weeping over supporting a few Android screen sizes, now throw in keyboarding, vs. touchscreen vs. whatever input device and the complexity gets pretty crazy. It would definitely require a big change in software development practices.
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