Drop Dropbox • Hacker News Board

Re: Drop Dropbox

#611

Post by Nursie » Thu, Apr 10, 2014, 5:07 PM UTC

grellas wrote: post #538

Think about what it means to the HN culture to have a subject that normally would have been flagged out of existence as overtly political suddenly be featured front and center in the apparent belief that ideological purity is now a litmus test for who can serve on a board of directors in the startup world. In a free society, people can unite in their business ventures even though they might be far apart in how they v…

>> Politics, religion, and social worldviews divide people and have no place as limiting tests in a business environment.

Of course they do.

Voting with our wallets is almost the only democratic right remaining to us lowly consumers these days. Choosing which companies to support directly impacts the sort of society we build.

>> Do we really want a counterpart agenda now setting rules for who can be a founder, who can be an investor, who can be a director, who can be a CEO, or who can otherwise take a prominent role in the startup world? The answer should be an emphatic no.

Who's setting rules? People are saying 'if you take on this person, whose views I disagree with so very fundamentally, I can no longer have any trust in your organisation meeting my needs'.

There is nothing at all wrong with this.

Re: Drop Dropbox

#612

Post by kzrdude » Thu, Apr 10, 2014, 5:07 PM UTC

aeroevan wrote: post #422

gnopgnip wrote: post #358

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could you provide a source for this? There is an entire process that is full of oversight.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anwar_al-Awlaki is the case most people bring up. Killed by a drone strike without due process, but nobody claims that he was anything but a terrorist.

And his US-born US citizen 16-year old son was killed in a separate strike. Nobody claims he was a terrorist.

Re: Drop Dropbox

#613

Post by VikingCoder » Thu, Apr 10, 2014, 5:08 PM UTC

callmeed wrote: post #605

VikingCoder wrote: post #561

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I want a company to actively fight the government's intrusion into my data, to ensure that my rights are defended. With this appointment, I have no faith that the Dropbox Board of Directors see their role this way.

If you want that from a company, isn't having someone who used to be deeply involved in the other side a great way to do it? I'm not saying that's what they'll do, but we don't know either way do we?

If it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, and has on numerous occasions gone on Sunday morning talk shows to assert that being a duck is the only way to preserve America's place as a leader in the free world...

...it's a duck.

Re: Drop Dropbox

#614

Post by ripter » Thu, Apr 10, 2014, 5:08 PM UTC

pvnick wrote: post #253

I'm not sure how I feel about this. On the one hand, I absolutely agree with most of the opposition to Condi Rice wrt the illegal war, warrantless wiretaps, torture, etc. On the other hand, I threw a hissy fit over the opposition to Eich based on his beliefs. I'm not sure how I can oppose Rice while standing up for Eich without inconsistency. Anybody else feel conflicted and have some insight? I'm still probably goin…

I'm in the same boat. Other people have pointed out how she's done things far worse than Eich. But here is my reasoning.

If you disagree with the board of a company and you want to stop using them, thats fine. Doesn't matter if it's Eich or Rice. Don't like them, stop using their products/services.

What isn't right is personally attacking either of them. Don't like Rice, that fine, you can post a blog or say whatever you want. Crossing the line is harassing them and sending death threats.

If the whole Eich thing would have stayed with people talking about how they don't like him, I wouldn't have a problem. When people started harassing him and it became popular to harass him it crossed the line. So far I haven't heard of anyone harassing Rice. (Maybe people do and they "disappear", I don't know.)

Re: Drop Dropbox

#615

Post by Nursie » Thu, Apr 10, 2014, 5:09 PM UTC

callmeed wrote: post #605

VikingCoder wrote: post #561

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I want a company to actively fight the government's intrusion into my data, to ensure that my rights are defended. With this appointment, I have no faith that the Dropbox Board of Directors see their role this way.

If you want that from a company, isn't having someone who used to be deeply involved in the other side a great way to do it? I'm not saying that's what they'll do, but we don't know either way do we?

Not when they have a history of not seeing your side of it as important in the slightest, no.

Re: Drop Dropbox

#616

Post by notahacker » Thu, Apr 10, 2014, 5:09 PM UTC

mikeash wrote: post #426

droopybuns wrote: post #393

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find this offensive and foolish. People should put more effort into holding their politicians accountable while they are in office- not for settling idealogical scores after they reenter private life. We the people have no one to blame but ourselves for this. It is the voter's fault that these people are able to flourish. If we don't take our civic responsibilities seriously, then these kinds of campaigns are petty…

"You need to do more than vote." Could you be more specific? It doesn't help to berate me for not doing more without actually telling me what I can do. Because I feel pretty helpless here and I have no idea what I can do besides vote and talk to people.

Ironically, the one tactic that might be more effective than the ballot in deterring bad leadership is hitting bad leaders in the pocket by.... making them into pariahs that corporations don't want to associated with.

Re: Drop Dropbox

#617

Post by vdaniuk » Thu, Apr 10, 2014, 5:09 PM UTC

callmeed wrote: post #605

VikingCoder wrote: post #561

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I want a company to actively fight the government's intrusion into my data, to ensure that my rights are defended. With this appointment, I have no faith that the Dropbox Board of Directors see their role this way.

If you want that from a company, isn't having someone who used to be deeply involved in the other side a great way to do it? I'm not saying that's what they'll do, but we don't know either way do we?

Political connections create multiple conflict of interests in various domains, namely providing access to power and information as long as the person in question doesn't act against those connections. It is very improbable that Rice would be working against her past political allies for democracy ideals, taking into consideration her track record.

Re: Drop Dropbox

#618

Post by joshstrange » Thu, Apr 10, 2014, 5:09 PM UTC

Piskvorrr wrote: post #112

aw3c2 wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's closed source and proprietary so it is no solution for me.

As opposed to...Dropbox?!? (Recap: "Dropbox substitute?" "What about BTSync?" "Meh, isn't open")

To be fair aw3c2 never said they use Dropbox and while uptown's question was most certainly in respect to "Dropbox alternatives" their question is only asking about "the security and privacy of BTSync" to which aw3c2 responded.

Re: Drop Dropbox

#619

Post by mikeash » Thu, Apr 10, 2014, 5:09 PM UTC

droopybuns wrote: post #566

mikeash wrote: post #426

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"You need to do more than vote." Could you be more specific? It doesn't help to berate me for not doing more without actually telling me what I can do. Because I feel pretty helpless here and I have no idea what I can do besides vote and talk to people.

I think we need to actively engage. So that means we actually do need to volunteer. We do need to donate. We even need to run for office. I don't know if my experience is a corner case- but every politician I've ever met has been weird. They don't seem like normal americans. We need to recognize that the world runs on PACs and that if we don't have a PAC to advocate our position, we're not going to get the outcomes w…

Who do I volunteer with and donate to? There are no political parties I can stomach. Even if you go beyond the two big ones and posit that it's useful to contribute to a third party (and I'm already skeptical of that), they're all completely bonkers.

Run for office? That's too much of a sacrifice to ask. It's not a job I want, by far. If I ever managed to get nominated, I'd do my best to sabotage my own campaign so as not to get elected. No wonder politicians are all weird, no normal person could ever want to be one.

Is not "accept when we lose" completely contradictory to the rest of what you're saying? You say that we should get out and do things to fight for what we believe, and then you turn around and say we should just let it go. This isn't some pointless notion of vengeance, it's a real concern over what her involvement with Dropbox could mean for the company and our data in the future.

Personally, if you claim to value democracy and then call it anti-democratic when there's a completely non-violent grassroots campaign against a political figure, then you're completely off your rocker. Nothing could possibly be more democratic. Even if you disagree with the campaign, how can you call the very idea a bad thing? What could possibly be a better way to exercise your political views than to vote with your wallet and encourage others to do the same? Are we supposed to just shut up and ignore it all? Are we supposed to vote with our own wallet but never talk to other people about it? How does that fit in with "volunteer, donate, run for office, the world runs on PACs"?

Re: Drop Dropbox

#620

Post by jmharvey » Thu, Apr 10, 2014, 5:09 PM UTC

1337biz wrote: post #558

grellas wrote: post #538

Think about what it means to the HN culture to have a subject that normally would have been flagged out of existence as overtly political suddenly be featured front and center in the apparent belief that ideological purity is now a litmus test for who can serve on a board of directors in the startup world. In a free society, people can unite in their business ventures even though they might be far apart in how they v…

What I find more revealing that, while similar politically loaded, this topic remains untouched by the moderators. Interfering with the "community" system is such a slippery slope and we are apparently watching another one of these revealing moments.

This seems like an "avoid the appearance of impropriety" situation. The HN mods don't want it to devolve into a political board, but killing a controversial story about the model YC company would certainly generate accusations of favoritism.