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Agony of an African programmer

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Re: Agony of an African programmer

#51

Post by null_ptr »

rodgerd wrote: post #21
chestnut-tree wrote: post #17

The patchy and expensive internet access that many people around the world experience really emphasises the importance of offline or native apps. There's a relentless (and in my view unnecesary) push by many technology companies to run everything online as if it's some natural progression we should all be moving towards. Some of us, even with broadband access, don't want to run apps in the cloud, (where everything we…

> I'm not convinced it's a better experience for users either It's a weird situation where we have vast power available on our local environments and burn it all to run JavaScript VMs to access huge server farms for functionality which in many cases was already available in local applications.

It's all about moving the software market from an owning model to a renting model. If you depend on their online service to always be around and available to you in order to access your data and get things done, they have a tighter leash on you. Not to mention that cloud apps make it that much easier to data mine usage, pander advertisements, and squeeze pennies out of users at every opportunity.

Re: Agony of an African programmer

#52

Post by nmrm »

batoure wrote: post #34
Dewie wrote: post #30

> The problem is that, though the syllabus looks good and would be a good starting point for being a software and web developer, these students do not spend time working on their personal projects and instead code for a grade “A” in exams. What, these students only work on getting good results in school, where they're studying? What a bunch of slackers.

I think that this may feel like a fun line to poke at but based on my experience in this part of the world I would say that what the author is getting at is that in education (with no exceptions given for learning software) there is a base belief in learning by route. people learn the single method to accomplish a task, if you ask them to do that very specific task that was on their c++ final in that way they will ex…

Which is a strong argument for rigorous coursework. The type that's sufficiently time-consuming that it trades off with personal projects.

Re: Agony of an African programmer

#53

Post by batoure »

nmrm wrote: post #52
batoure wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that this may feel like a fun line to poke at but based on my experience in this part of the world I would say that what the author is getting at is that in education (with no exceptions given for learning software) there is a base belief in learning by route. people learn the single method to accomplish a task, if you ask them to do that very specific task that was on their c++ final in that way they will ex…

Which is a strong argument for rigorous coursework. The type that's sufficiently time-consuming that it trades off with personal projects.

Definitely, however this is a situation caused by a lack of teaching talent. Teachers are simply not skilled enough to create a programming curriculum that could be considered rigorous.

Re: Agony of an African programmer

#54

Post by 1rae »

wallzz wrote: post #37

I think the article is plein of cliché about the africa: electricity, internet price ?!! seriously these things have been improved in most of african countries especially in the north of Africa (Ghana has the fastest internet speed in africa ), and now its much more an advantage than of disadvantage for tech companies.especially for salaries and low fees. The question that I looked for an answer for in the article is…

I think one of the best examples I know of is Cape Town, but it is definitely a microcosm compared to the rest of Africa. There is an initiative to create a silicon valley environment with angel investors as well, http://www.siliconcape.com. There are opportunities for government investing options as well, which provide funding in exchange for creating a company that can provide stable jobs to locals for years to come.

I think the the situation in South Africa will also improve as we start developing the square kilometre radio telescope array to the north of Cape Town - which will require large amounts of server and computing power for data processing. This will attract more international interest, and Cape Town is also the home of an Amazon dev. centre.

It is true that Ghana has good internet access, the same is true for Zimbabwe (even though it has such a bad reputation, fibre optic internet is available). I think in the future we will see more data centres being built in Africa for worldwide redundancy. I think this will happen in Ghana and Nigeria as they have oil reserves to power the data centres as well as low risk for earth quakes.

I think there are lots of opportunities for tech hubs to arise in Africa, even though there are still lots of problems, it may even happen in an unlikely place, for instance Mauritius is trying to be forward thinking and is going to start providing tablets to every child on the island. Zambia are pushing for improved tech infrastructure - widespread rural telecommunications, which may lead to the development of large mesh networks. I think we have many opportunities to solve these problems we face in Africa with technology, with many opportunities for growth, and Africans are particularly hungry for change.

Re: Agony of an African programmer

#55

Post by mbesto »

bdcravens wrote: post #15
w1ntermute wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, it's not really accurate for the PIGS , and even in northern Europe, it's not as high as in the States.

I had to look the term up, but my first guess was correct ("Portugal, Italy, Greece, Spain") http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PIGS_(economics)

FYI - Another one I learned while being in Europe is FIGS, which sort of represents the "more economically developed" Euro languages - French, Italian, German, Spanish. This pretty much covers every nation you would need to speak to in order to do legitimate business in Europe. (Scandinavia generally will do business with English speakers)

Re: Agony of an African programmer

#57

Post by aditiyaa1 »

w1ntermute wrote: post #9
mtct wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I, in Italy, as a junior software developer, earn €17000/year. And genuinely I'm not complaining.

Yeah, it's not really accurate for the PIGS , and even in northern Europe, it's not as high as in the States.

Portugal, Italy, Greece and Spain

Re: Agony of an African programmer

#58

Post by w1ntermute »

mbesto wrote: post #55
bdcravens wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I had to look the term up, but my first guess was correct ("Portugal, Italy, Greece, Spain") http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PIGS_(economics)

FYI - Another one I learned while being in Europe is FIGS, which sort of represents the "more economically developed" Euro languages - French, Italian, German, Spanish. This pretty much covers every nation you would need to speak to in order to do legitimate business in Europe. (Scandinavia generally will do business with English speakers)

The Germans are pretty solid English speakers too. More so than the French, Italians, or Spaniards, anyway.

Re: Agony of an African programmer

#59

Post by lgleason »

gamegoblin wrote: post #6
cliveowen wrote: post #3

"A web and software developer in Africa earns from $10,000 to $20,000 dollars per annum whereas their colleagues in Europe and the US earns at least $100,000 dollars per year." I don't think this is factually true. That said, the article really makes you think how much easy we have it in the developed world, yet we always find the time to complain about everything.

In the Midwest, 60K/yr is not uncommon. I know a dev with 7 years experience making ~50K. But the cost of living here is nothing. I spend under 20K/yr and I eat out plenty, live in a 1000 sq ft apartment, etc. My friend making 50K supports his wife and kid easily in the new house they just got. Cost of living is huge factor when taking into account salary and location. 10K in the vast majority of African countries pu…

Something doesn't sound right with this. In Atlanta a developer worth their salt with 7 years of experience is going to be getting into the 80-100K range depending on their skills etc.. The only time it is lower is if they are with a startup and taking equity. Atlanta is also much less expensive the New York, San Fran etc..

Looking at Ruby developer salaries it looks like there is a bit of a different between Atlanta and the midwest, but the spread between New York, Atlanta and the Midwest appears to be a 30k difference from what I could find online. Which skill set does the developer with 7 years of experience have making 50K?

I'm genuinely curious.

Re: Agony of an African programmer

#60

Post by pessimizer »

delinka wrote: post #8
cliveowen wrote: post #3

"A web and software developer in Africa earns from $10,000 to $20,000 dollars per annum whereas their colleagues in Europe and the US earns at least $100,000 dollars per year." I don't think this is factually true. That said, the article really makes you think how much easy we have it in the developed world, yet we always find the time to complain about everything.

"I don't think this is factually true." Agreed. I work in a US metropolis. I don't know any web developers making $100,000 per year. I know seasoned software developers and engineers making that, but that is what experience costs. I can't really speak to the author's experience, but often, this downtrodden treatise on salary disparity tends to come from the younger, less-experienced programmers out there, regardless…

As another data point: I work in a (non-NY, non-CA) US metropolis, am largely a web developer, make $100k per year, and don't know many who don't who aren't absolutely at the beginning of their careers.

3-5 years of experience seems to be enough for 100k as far as I can tell. I don't think his lament is that far off.

edit: I may just be assuming that my peers make more than they do, though. It might be more accurate to say that it seems like most of the peers I meet socially make as much as me or (sometimes much) more, and when I hear about companies that are looking for someone, it's always in the 100k+ range.

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