Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

DNS results now being manipulated in Turkey

news.ycombinator.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

61–70 of 73 posts

Re: DNS results now being manipulated in Turkey

#61

Post by wtallis »

davidu wrote: post #53
vijayp wrote: post #14

Too bad DNSSEC isn't widely used; signing the records would prevent this from working. The government could still block the DNS requests, though.

As I pointed out above, DNSSEC doesn't stop this. I am not just a DNSSEC hater, but the level of misunderstanding on DNSSEC is quite large. When victim issues a query for youtube.com, I can intercept that query and hand back whatever response I want. Unless the victim KNOWS IN ADVANCE (which DNSSEC doesn't offer) that the response should be DNSSEC signed, they will accept my forged response. DNSSEC solves problems we…

Can't you say the same thing about users who don't know to expect their connection to use TLS? What you're claiming as the problem isn't a problem with DNSSEC, but with the absence of DNSSEC. If DNSSEC were the default, then this attack couldn't happen.

Re: DNS results now being manipulated in Turkey

#62

Post by hadoukenio »

ryanobjc wrote: post #50
hadoukenio wrote: post #42

The NSA and GCHQ have been doing this for years, so why complain about Turkey doing this? The only difference I can see is targeting individuals vs targeting the general population.

When I see messages like this, I start to think... who is this person. What are their agenda? What's the chance they are turkish? After all, if you cannot see the difference between the alleged single person targeting and the blanket targeting of an entire population, I'm not really sure you deserve to be here. I guess I'll leave you with that Stalin quote "Death of one man is a tragedy. Death of a million is a stati…

Wow, a bit harsh.

What I was trying to say was that Governments do shit like this, regardless of if they are China, North Korea, Turkey or America. In terms of doing things against their citizens, every country is in the Axis of Evil, so STOP complaining and instead get behind projects that will fix this shit by making the internet bulletproof.

Re: DNS results now being manipulated in Turkey

#63

Post by hadoukenio »

javajosh wrote: post #49
hadoukenio wrote: post #42

The NSA and GCHQ have been doing this for years, so why complain about Turkey doing this? The only difference I can see is targeting individuals vs targeting the general population.

Your tacit assertion is that if something wrong is done for years, and you find out it's done one more time, you shouldn't bother complaining about it. People like you have existed for all time, and will always exist, but your views truly don't matter: change comes because people continue to fight for what is right, despite the balance of years. Slavery on US soil had been legal and "normal" for hundreds of years, bu…

See my reply to the other comment.

Re: DNS results now being manipulated in Turkey

#64

Post by darkhorn »

mrtksn wrote: post #9
alex1 wrote: post #8

Can you do a traceroute to 8.8.4.4? If it's actually reaching Google's network, then yeah, they're doing deep packet inspection on DNS traffic. If not, they're probably just routing 8.8.4.4 to a DNS server they control. If their goal is to manipulate traffic to www.youtube.com (probably to block access to certain videos), another solution would be for YouTube to require SSL for all connections coming from Turkish IPs…

how about this: http://i.imgur.com/2jEais0.png

What application is this?

Re: DNS results now being manipulated in Turkey

#65

Post by gaoshan »

"Using VPNs seems like the only valid solution"

But a government like China interferes with even VPNs (more so outside of the greater Shanghai and Beijing metro areas, in case anyone is sitting in those areas saying "My VPN works great"... they permit it and can block or interfere with it anytime they like) so I don't think they are really a solution. In China, nothing really works if the authorities don't want it to. VPNs are degraded to the point of being unusable, SOCKs proxy over SSH is the same, TOR is unusably slow, etc. Unfortunately, I don't think there really IS a solution in the face of determined governmental interference.

Re: DNS results now being manipulated in Turkey

#66

Post by aib »

est wrote: post #39
lemonade wrote: post #17

There are many more public DNS servers out there, too many to block.There is a nice comprehensive list here: http://public-dns.tk/ You might also be interested in https://dnscrypt.eu .

They mangle all udp port 53 data.

No, there's no mangling of data (apart from HTTP which gets injected with a RST flagged packet once in a while)

Re: DNS results now being manipulated in Turkey

#67

Post by stayparanoid »

Jugurtha wrote: post #27
michh wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's the whole point: they seem to be using deep packet inspection to mess with all DNS traffic regardless of the DNS server being used.

Aha, I see. I'll look this up in addition to what kijin said (sshuttle). It's not like our government is blocking anything (there were rumors it was blocking Facebook in 2011, but it wasn't true as I was able to log in without any issue. It was just slow, but it's not like we have the fastest internet here). But it's nice to know. Thanks for the clarification.

Were you logging in on the actual facebook? how can you tell? Logging in isn't a proof that that is the real facebook, dude. And doesn't "It was just slow" ring any bell?

Re: DNS results now being manipulated in Turkey

#68

Post by bayesianhorse »

beagle3 wrote: post #60
bayesianhorse wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually, whereas I don't think Turkey is that far "gone" on the antidemocratic spectrum, but it has one thing in common with more severe cases of "border-line" democracy, like Russia: It's not the money that rigs the government, it's the government that rigs the money. In some sense, the US with their absurdly high campaign spending, avoid this kind of corruption either way just by competition. Even if a single inte…

The US elections are equally rigged - you vote for which faction of the mil-ind complex you like, and whether planned parenthood is funded - but not anything like wars, which simple continue as scheduled.

Rigged? I don't think so. But if you accept that you can't vote for every single decision because of practical reasons (and because multiple single-issue-votes tend to contradict each other), you can only vote for the general direction, and in the US this means you have a choice of about two directions. In other democracies you might have three or four directions but those countries tend to have more issues with incompetency and corruption.

However the "axis" of these two directions is aligned by the general public. If people care about wars, the parties would align towards "war" and "no war" for an election. But they don't, because beginning and ending a war isn't something that works well with elections or any arbitrarily timed decision process for that matter.

Governments have to be able to start a war or not end it at the wrong time, otherwise you might as well let non-democratic countries take you to the cleaners...

Re: DNS results now being manipulated in Turkey

#69

Post by Jugurtha »

stayparanoid wrote: post #67
Jugurtha wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Aha, I see. I'll look this up in addition to what kijin said (sshuttle). It's not like our government is blocking anything (there were rumors it was blocking Facebook in 2011, but it wasn't true as I was able to log in without any issue. It was just slow, but it's not like we have the fastest internet here). But it's nice to know. Thanks for the clarification.

Were you logging in on the actual facebook? how can you tell? Logging in isn't a proof that that is the real facebook, dude. And doesn't "It was just slow" ring any bell?

It wasn't slower than many times where nothing was happening. Internet here just sucks. Whether it's peace and birds are singing, or scortched earth, it's all the same.

Plus how can you tell it isn't the actual Facebook if everything is there, status, etc, comments, pictures. I can chat with other users, send messages, etc.

Re: DNS results now being manipulated in Turkey

#70

Post by ttflee »

gaoshan wrote: post #65

"Using VPNs seems like the only valid solution" But a government like China interferes with even VPNs (more so outside of the greater Shanghai and Beijing metro areas, in case anyone is sitting in those areas saying "My VPN works great"... they permit it and can block or interfere with it anytime they like) so I don't think they are really a solution. In China, nothing really works if the authorities don't want it to…

Choose an expensive VPN. Those free ones are the ones got quickly blocked as more people would be using them which in turn results in the blockage.
Post reply on HN