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Mozilla employees tell Brendan Eich he needs to “step down”

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Re: Mozilla employees tell Brendan Eich he needs to “step down”

#41

Post by m0a0t0 »

simias wrote: post #32
stormcrowsx wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eich was actively trying to stop what many people think should be a human right. He should face flak, and get a hard time over it, they should threaten his position. Even if they don't get him out of CEO it will make the next idiot that's high up in a company think twice before donating to stop human rights.

Come on, he didn't fund the war in Uganda. I don't share his views or anything but I don't see why "not liking the gays" or whatever should have any influence at all on whether or not he's suitable to run a tech company. It's not a political office.

I think one of the big problems is that he is head of Mozilla which has a reputation of being a do good organisation. Having someone who did bad (as some people would say) isn't really in line with that

Re: Mozilla employees tell Brendan Eich he needs to “step down”

#42

Post by Jormundir »

eigenvector wrote: post #4

The fact that they can come out and say this demonstrates that these employees, the people best able to assess this, don't believe that Eich will retaliate. That Mozilla is and remains a place where any employee can express their views on political issues, even if they know they're contrary to the CEO's. And that destroys any argument for Eich's role as CEO creating a conflict with Mozilla's ability to welcome LGBTQ…

I wouldn't call it a witch hunt. Now every Mozilla employee's work is contributing to Eich's paycheck. The paycheck with which he will (has) donate(d) to oppose gay marriage. If I was a Mozilla employee, this is not something I would want to be contributing to.

This argument can obviously be applied to any employee in the company, but it's severely exacerbated when it's applied to the CEO, who's getting a huge paycheck and is serving as the face of the company. It would be nice if we could separate his work from his personal life, but that separation does not actually exist. His personal endeavors are fueled by his professional life. (This is why we all work, really).

Re: Mozilla employees tell Brendan Eich he needs to “step down”

#44

Post by freehunter »

devrelm wrote: post #35
ivanca wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How far does it go? Would you say the same about a nazi or KKK member?

Godwin's Law in 16 minutes. Not bad.

That's not a Godwin. Nazis were/are well known to promote hate based on differences between people and promote laws to keep certain groups oppressed. It's a perfectly valid comparison.

Re: Mozilla employees tell Brendan Eich he needs to “step down”

#45

Post by Mikeb85 »

mikestew wrote: post #8

Just the CEO? Who else shall we burn at the stake? Mary, the office manager, goes to church every Sunday. How did she vote? John over in mobile dev is a devout Muslim, I'll bet he doesn't take kindly to such things as gay marriage. Time to start scanning through those campaign contribution records for Prop 8 and seeing if a JOIN on the employee database gives us any results. I've always held to the idea that my job i…

Thank you for posting this.

It's insane that there's this witch-hunt over someone's personal views, and the fact that this outlandish behaviour is actually supported and applauded by people.

If anything this just gives more credence to the 'gay agenda' conspiracies that up until fairly recently no one took seriously...

Re: Mozilla employees tell Brendan Eich he needs to “step down”

#46

Post by angersock »

ivanca wrote: post #12
david927 wrote: post #5

It's his personal view. What does freedom mean if it's only about views that everyone likes?

How far does it go? Would you say the same about a nazi or KKK member?

The Chicago police protected neo-nazis when they marched in Skokie--at a time when there were residents there who still had tattoos from the camps.

So, yeah, we should strive to protect freedom of speech and be tolerant, even when people are shitbags.

Re: Mozilla employees tell Brendan Eich he needs to “step down”

#47

Post by slantyyz »

ojii wrote: post #14
david927 wrote: post #5

It's his personal view. What does freedom mean if it's only about views that everyone likes?

In my opinion, appointing someone as CEO can not be base purely on professional performance. The CEO position is too public to ignore personal actions. Eich is of course allowed to have his own opinion on issues, such as gay marriage. But now being CEO of Mozilla, Mozilla has to ask themselves if his personal views are in line with the views/mission of Mozilla as a company. The freedom to have your own opinion on thi…

>> The freedom to have your own opinion on things does not protect you from the consequences of those opinions.

Yes. In the same vein, people publicly calling out their employers in social media (even when justified) should also realize that it's a potentially career limiting move.

I'm pretty sure there's a significant number of companies and HR managers who would be reluctant to hire people who have engaged in this type of communication in the past.

Re: Mozilla employees tell Brendan Eich he needs to “step down”

#48

Post by badman_ting »

david927 wrote: post #5

It's his personal view. What does freedom mean if it's only about views that everyone likes?

Yeah, and the employee's view is that he's not fit for CEO. I'm sick of this line of thought that he can have his views but nobody else can. Especially because if it were a different issue than gay marriage nobody would be saying that.

Re: Mozilla employees tell Brendan Eich he needs to “step down”

#49

Post by cdmckay »

simias wrote: post #32
stormcrowsx wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eich was actively trying to stop what many people think should be a human right. He should face flak, and get a hard time over it, they should threaten his position. Even if they don't get him out of CEO it will make the next idiot that's high up in a company think twice before donating to stop human rights.

Come on, he didn't fund the war in Uganda. I don't share his views or anything but I don't see why "not liking the gays" or whatever should have any influence at all on whether or not he's suitable to run a tech company. It's not a political office.

So if he donated to the KKK, would you still think "not liking non-white people" or whatever should have any influence on whether or not he's suitable to run a tech company? It's not a political office.

Re: Mozilla employees tell Brendan Eich he needs to “step down”

#50

Post by MattGrommes »

simias wrote: post #32
stormcrowsx wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eich was actively trying to stop what many people think should be a human right. He should face flak, and get a hard time over it, they should threaten his position. Even if they don't get him out of CEO it will make the next idiot that's high up in a company think twice before donating to stop human rights.

Come on, he didn't fund the war in Uganda. I don't share his views or anything but I don't see why "not liking the gays" or whatever should have any influence at all on whether or not he's suitable to run a tech company. It's not a political office.

He has a large say in the benefits and culture of the company he's going to be running. If he doesn't believe gay people should have all the rights and protections of straight people, how are they supposed to feel about the future of their benefits and culture of the company they work for?

Also, it's not about "not liking the gays". It's about things like letting gay partners have the same rights in medical cases of their spouses as straight spouses. It's about child custody, death benefits, and lots of other very important things that may not be a war in Uganda but they are massively important and life-changing for the people involved.

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