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A simple way to "get more people to code"

yosefk.com

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Re: A simple way to "get more people to code"

#41

Post by sanderjd »

_yosefk wrote: post #22
aufreak3 wrote: post #17

I believe the "get more people to code" movement wasn't about "we need more programmers". It was about what Alan Kay might call "digital literacy".

And why do we need digital literacy any more than machine gun literacy or brain surgery literacy or anything like that? Except Alan Kay, everyone knows perfectly well how useless programming is to anyone but the professional programmer.

I think the "learn to code" movement should eventually evolve into "learn to X", where X is something that does prove to be widely useful, and for which "coding" is a prerequisite skill. Data analysis strikes me as a possible value for that X.

Re: A simple way to "get more people to code"

#43

Post by jperks »

It is a real problem in Germany where IT market has 0% of programmers' unemployment, so they introduced Blue cards welcoming programmers from Eastern Europe. And it helps them, they get the workforce of moderate price, ready to learn and speak German. Their work language is English. So if it was a Real problem in the US, they would do the same. So far, it seems like another buzz.

Re: A simple way to "get more people to code"

#44

Post by ChristofferSN »

doctorwho wrote: post #8

After 25+ years of coding and reading other people's code I would submit that the REAL problem is that the people who do code don't do it very well, some are downright stupid. There are a lot of people out there who will never be able to produce anything beyond "Hello World" and some will struggle to get that far. What if we focused early on identifying kids with good problem solving skill and other aptitudes that mi…

I think that one of the reasons we see so much bad code, is that customers have a very hard time evaluating the quality of the code, and therefore both problems could be solved by learning more people how to write code.

I feel that I can write as bad code as I want to, and still get away with it (not that I do it), since nobody realizes it is bad until another programmer works on it which might be years later, or even never.

If bad programmers were identified easier, they would be forced to go out of business or start to make better programs! And with more people that can actually code, people wouldn't be forced to choose the bad programmers.

Re: A simple way to "get more people to code"

#45

Post by dropit_sphere »

jonsen wrote: post #28
dropit_sphere wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then...drop their salary? Are these companies being run by four-year-olds? "We lured developers with huge compensation packages because we only want rockstars, but we end up losing money on them!" Which is it? Is it a highly valuable skill that everyone should learn (why doesn't the company owner learn it then?), or is it "sneaky non-unionized-and-colluded-against-by-Google-and-Apple developers aren't "worth" their s…

How could there not be almost nobody but "four-year-olds" in an immature and fast pacing technology sector?

But there are not. A sector being new is not a constraint on the individuals.

Plus, pleading about inexperience seems a little late. It's 2014. The Mythical Man Month was written what, 40 years ago? Maybe I'm off and it's 30. Still?

Honestly as I think about it, that is a book everyone should read. Managing software development is a more valuable skill than the actual development.

Re: A simple way to "get more people to code"

#46

Post by FLUX-YOU »

rokhayakebe wrote: post #27
doctorwho wrote: post #8

After 25+ years of coding and reading other people's code I would submit that the REAL problem is that the people who do code don't do it very well, some are downright stupid. There are a lot of people out there who will never be able to produce anything beyond "Hello World" and some will struggle to get that far. What if we focused early on identifying kids with good problem solving skill and other aptitudes that mi…

I think EVERYONE should learn to code just as everyone learns ARITHMETIC. Imagine a world where only a few of us knew how to balance an account, or a few of us understood how much will they have left if they spent x amount at the gas station. Now imagine a world where everybody has a basic ability to develop software. All the above being said, the beginning is not programming, but learning how to Think, Read, and Wri…

>Now imagine a world where everybody has a basic ability to develop software.

Pointless, I think. They'll only be able to make the most basic of software. Existing programmers complain about bad code and naive solutions already. This will only compound the issue.

I'm not sure if programming teaches critical thinking, reading and writing any better than the existing subjects we have.

Re: A simple way to "get more people to code"

#47

Post by ZeroGravitas »

fasteddie31003 wrote: post #34
doctorwho wrote: post #8

After 25+ years of coding and reading other people's code I would submit that the REAL problem is that the people who do code don't do it very well, some are downright stupid. There are a lot of people out there who will never be able to produce anything beyond "Hello World" and some will struggle to get that far. What if we focused early on identifying kids with good problem solving skill and other aptitudes that mi…

"Problem solving skills" is an overly broad, corporate word, which is just as bad as synergy, in my opinion. You cannot test for "problem solving skills". However, you can test for more concrete definitions of intelligence ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theory_of_multiple_intelligence... ). I am a decent programmer and I was never amazing at formal schooling. I always scored really high for visual–spatial intelligenc…

I was intrigued by your comment about visual-spatial intelligence predicting programmer ability so I googled it.

What I found suggested it predicted computing careers (along with science and engineering, and negatively predicting Law, Social Sciences end Education) not talent at programming (or Law or Engineering etc.).

Also, it correlates with being male (though the researchers claim that female scores can be boosted with some training). It's not clear if that was taken into account when calculating the careers.

Re: A simple way to "get more people to code"

#48

Post by gtirloni »

One idea that comes to mind is the creation of a website with a list of problems that could be solved by coding, if someone would step up and do it. Regular citizens that are impacted by these issues would perhaps think they have a shot at solving a real problem for them, by coding something.

The main point is, some people might not be interested in coding just for the sake of it...

Is there such a list? Social hacks? Coding for change? What resources I could show a fellow citizen to get him/her fired up about coding?

Re: A simple way to "get more people to code"

#49

Post by nathas »

dropit_sphere wrote: post #40
nathas wrote: post #32

This is an understandable way to look at the problem, but I think it's largely wrong. You need to capture minds while they're still very open to learning. People are locking themselves into career paths by the time they graduate college, at least in America. Student loans means getting a second degree in something you rather do is largely impossible since you have to start paying down your debt when you graduate. A h…

"This is an understandable way to look at the problem." Who says it's a problem?

The author. It's the heading of the first paragraph after the disclaimer.

Re: A simple way to "get more people to code"

#50

Post by joshdance »

Asking the government to create more coders seems like a good idea until you realize that our government doesn't 'know how to code'. Who would validate the code being submitted for benefits was good? That the children were learning? I realize this proposal is slightly humorous, but that was my first thought.
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