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Julie Ann Horvath Describes Sexism and Intimidation Behind Her GitHub Exit

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Re: Julie Ann Horvath Describes Sexism and Intimidation Behind Her GitHub Exit

#131

Post by dsl »

rdl wrote: post #24
iwasphone wrote: post #19

> Horvath then told her partner, also a GitHub employee... Protip: don't dip your pen in the company ink.

At big paranoid organizations (CIA, NSA, etc.), they actively encourage internal relationships and marriages, as it simplifies security modeling. But not really in the same group.

You are encouraged to have relationships within the community, but not necessarily at the same agency or within the same directorate.

In a division the size of GitHub (in terms of total employees), a relationship would be frowned upon and one of you would likely be transferred.

Re: Julie Ann Horvath Describes Sexism and Intimidation Behind Her GitHub Exit

#132

Post by jsmthrowaway »

theorique wrote: post #98

The bad actor in this version of the story seems to be the founder's wife. And the founder certainly dropped the ball by not keeping his wife in line. For whatever reason, the wife acted crazy, intimidating, and creepy toward Horvath. Why? Who knows? Maybe because of jealousy or concern that her husband was interested in this (admittedly reasonably attractive) female employee? The founder needed to do the professiona…

> keeping his wife in line.

I have never cringed so hard in my life.

Re: Julie Ann Horvath Describes Sexism and Intimidation Behind Her GitHub Exit

#133

Post by noisyboy »

theorique wrote: post #98

The bad actor in this version of the story seems to be the founder's wife. And the founder certainly dropped the ball by not keeping his wife in line. For whatever reason, the wife acted crazy, intimidating, and creepy toward Horvath. Why? Who knows? Maybe because of jealousy or concern that her husband was interested in this (admittedly reasonably attractive) female employee? The founder needed to do the professiona…

More important than #1 or #2 (and probably easier to verify based on the tendency of version control systems to retain logs/history): he deleted a co-worker's code based on grudge.

Re: Julie Ann Horvath Describes Sexism and Intimidation Behind Her GitHub Exit

#134

Post by potatolicious »

korzun wrote: post #123
potatolicious wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "but isn't it to be expected that employees of a tech company will be somewhat socially awkward?" Reverting people's commits and stripping their code out of vengeance isn't social awkwardness, it's completely unacceptable and unprofessional conduct. It doesn't matter what gender anyone is, or that it's being done out of romantic rejection, it's unacceptable. Full stop. Author's complaint is evidently less about bei…

It's easy to assume things that were said without context. Was her code reverted at 12:00 AM because it broke the site? Or was it for something else? If so what? See how the context changes your opinion? Generic 'they reverted my code!' statement does not tell me anything.

That's why I qualified it with "out of vengeance". There are many legitimate reasons why you would revert somebody else's code, but doing so out of interpersonal conflict is not one of them.

Note that I'm not commenting on the authenticity of the accusations laid out in this specific instance. My point is that messing with people's code because you don't get along with them - whether it happened here or elsewhere, and whether the perpetrator is male or female - is entirely unprofessional and unacceptable. It cannot be attributed to social awkwardness.

Beyond the specifics of this complaint, we cannot keep falling back on the "hurr we're all aspies" excuse to explain away our shitty conduct. It is not only inaccurate, it is damaging and infantilizing to tech workers in general.

Re: Julie Ann Horvath Describes Sexism and Intimidation Behind Her GitHub Exit

#135

Post by LockeWatts »

lutusp wrote: post #126
jd0 wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because human beings have a desire to express opinion and emotion? Your attitude is the same as a lot of the socially inept that roam the valley and this message board. If This Isn't The Most Efficient Logical Course Of Action (according my perspective) Then It Bemuses Me.

> Because human beings have a desire to express opinion and emotion? Well, half of them, anyway.

Which half?

Re: Julie Ann Horvath Describes Sexism and Intimidation Behind Her GitHub Exit

#136

Post by Dylan16807 »

gamblor956 wrote: post #65
bitops wrote: post #53

As usual, another HN thread that perfectly exemplifies victim blaming and a collective burying of heads in the sand. There's a few people on here who seem to get it, but most don't. I'm sick of it. Goodbye, Hacker News.

This should be the top comment. As long as sexism persists in the tech industry, it's going to drive women out and keep others away.

No way in hell should it be the top comment. I can't find any victim blaming at all in a quick skim, so if it's here it's not by any means a plurality opinion. bitops is being even worse and reactionary than they claim HN to be.

Re: Julie Ann Horvath Describes Sexism and Intimidation Behind Her GitHub Exit

#137

Post by rdtsc »

lgleason wrote: post #92

I'm not going to get into what is right or wrong. With that being said, in the US HR is not your friend as an employee. Their job is to protect the company. http://abcnews.go.com/Business/20-job-tips-hr-exec/story?id=... Any way you look at it you have a bad situation. This sounds like a clash of personalities. While the behavior is not right, the fact is that a lot of companies will 'manage out' people unfairly etc.…

> Their job is to protect the company.

As a general rule, if you are not paying for their time, they don't have primarily your best interest in mind. The interest of those that they work for could temporarily align with your interests, but don't rely on getting a signal when that changes.

Re: Julie Ann Horvath Describes Sexism and Intimidation Behind Her GitHub Exit

#138

Post by interstitial »

bitops wrote: post #53

As usual, another HN thread that perfectly exemplifies victim blaming and a collective burying of heads in the sand. There's a few people on here who seem to get it, but most don't. I'm sick of it. Goodbye, Hacker News.

You suffer from egotistical self-righteousness. Someday, perhaps, you will no longer need to assuage your ego with delusional palliatives of moral superiority. Today a child died after a long and painful battle with cancer. Another died suddenly in a car crash after a heated argument, leaving loved ones in agony and self-doubt. Are you sure this is your battle? Perhaps you are only sick of the burden of your own unexamined piety and belief the universe must obey your whims.

Re: Julie Ann Horvath Describes Sexism and Intimidation Behind Her GitHub Exit

#139

Post by enneff »

theorique wrote: post #98

The bad actor in this version of the story seems to be the founder's wife. And the founder certainly dropped the ball by not keeping his wife in line. For whatever reason, the wife acted crazy, intimidating, and creepy toward Horvath. Why? Who knows? Maybe because of jealousy or concern that her husband was interested in this (admittedly reasonably attractive) female employee? The founder needed to do the professiona…

"Dropped the ball" ?!?!!??!?!?!

This is so far beyond inappropriate. If it is even 10% true then there are serious organisational problems at that company.

I am gobsmacked that people are leaping to downplay these accusations, without knowing anything about it.

Re: Julie Ann Horvath Describes Sexism and Intimidation Behind Her GitHub Exit

#140

Post by theorique »

jsmthrowaway wrote: post #132
theorique wrote: post #98

The bad actor in this version of the story seems to be the founder's wife. And the founder certainly dropped the ball by not keeping his wife in line. For whatever reason, the wife acted crazy, intimidating, and creepy toward Horvath. Why? Who knows? Maybe because of jealousy or concern that her husband was interested in this (admittedly reasonably attractive) female employee? The founder needed to do the professiona…

> keeping his wife in line. I have never cringed so hard in my life.

Well, not in the offensive sense of "bitch, you better behave or ima smack you", but at least something modern like "honey, when you talk to my employees and act really strange and intimidating around them, it makes things very difficult for me at work".

The wife's behavior seems to be the catalyst for nearly all the drama described here.

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