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Goodbye Popcorn Time

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Re: Goodbye Popcorn Time

#211

Post by b3b0p »

CodeMage wrote: post #179
DanBC wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You kickstart something because you want to help them make it, not because you want a product in return. While you could strip the copy protections that's a crime.

That's disingenuous. I am well aware that a Kickstarter pledge is not the same thing as a pre-order -- the project might fail, circumstances might change, etc. However, the $35 tier specifies that "You will receive a digital version of the movie within a few days of the movie's theatrical debut". I assume @b3b0p pledged an amount within that tier. Unless that assumption is wrong, the complaint is justified, at least…

Exactly, I supported the movie and I am glad I did, but I would not have done the amount I did had I known that the digital copy was going to be this Ultra Violet version. I would have pledged less or possibly pledged more to get the Blu-ray.

In the back of my mind I feared that the digital copy would be Ultra Violet. It was a gamble and understand it was a risk, that I ended up losing. I would buy the iTunes or Blu-ray now, but I don't want to spend more on a movie.

Re: Goodbye Popcorn Time

#212

Post by Daiz »

api wrote: post #178
Zigurd wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Until you come up with that thing, it's the choice we face.

Not really. You kind of missed my point. There is no DRM in my iTunes music, but I paid for it. Apple takes ~30% of iTunes though, so it still stinks, but at least the artist gets something. Part of why I use iTunes is that most of the research I see shows that buying music there or through similar classes of digital music services (and movies, etc., I get those there too) sends a greater amount of revenue to the art…

>Apple takes ~30% of iTunes though, so it still stinks

How exactly does it stink? Apple provides a service and a platform for selling music, and they take a cut so they can continue to provide said service, which obviously isn't free to run.

And if you're unhappy with the size of the cut they're taking, it's not like you don't have options - Bandcamp (my favorite digital music store simply because they have no region locking bullshit and default lossless with a whole bunch of other format options for one price, the same which unfortunately can't be said of most legal digital outlets) only takes a 10% cut, and if you want, you could always sell directly on your website with the likes of Stripe and such (but even then you're going to be paying some fees). Of course, the last one requires the most work on the artist's part, but that's how it goes - you either pay someone else to do it for you (the cuts on iTunes, Bandcamp, etc) or you do it yourself.

Re: Goodbye Popcorn Time

#213

Post by User8712 »

lucb1e wrote: post #202
User8712 wrote: post #31

Well, this is disappointing. It seemed like a nicely designed application, with an enthusiastic development team behind it. And now, within days, it's gone. If they wanted to avoid piracy, I think it might have had some potential going the legal route as well. It would be a nice interface to browse legal movies, documentaries, web series, etc. Strange decision, I could see a company like Netflix buying them out for a…

> I could see a company like Netflix buying them out Really? I think Netflix would "suddenly" have each and every contract broken and no content can be watched on Netflix services ever again. Well, with the exception of anything that runs on Popcorn, of course.

I never said Netflix would continue to run the application and let people stream illegal content. Let's break this down.

First off, it's a perfect fit. The Popcorn Time audience streams the latest movies and tv series. This is exactly the audience Netflix wants to target.

Popcorn Time hitting 100 million users doesn't seem far fetched. Netflix pays around $16 for each user that you refer to their free trial. Let's say Netflix buys Popcorn Time, converts it to movies that are in the public domain, and tries to refer everyone to the Netflix trial to continue streaming new films. We'll say 99% of people leave, and 1% take up the trial. That's 1 million trial users, which Netflix would currently pay 16 million dollars for in referral fees.

In short, it could easily grow into an application worth tens of millions to a company like Netflix.

The movie industry would love it. Netflix destroys the most popular service for illegally streaming movies, and they make some money off the Netflix subscribers.

If someone makes a successful fork, maybe we'll see this happen.

Re: Goodbye Popcorn Time

#214

Post by balladeer »

DanBC wrote: post #171
b3b0p wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was also a contributor to the Veronica Mars movie Kickstarter. When I received my email today and found out it was Ultra Violet, I was quite upset. I emailed the address they have listed on the F.A.Q. site with my complaint. I backed the Kickstarter, but in order to watch it on my AppleTV I have 2 options: 1. Purchase from iTunes. or 2. Pirate. The money I spent to back the Kickstarter could have been used for the…

You kickstart something because you want to help them make it, not because you want a product in return. While you could strip the copy protections that's a crime.

I help kick start something because I see that their idea is good and they need funding to convert that idea into a product. It's like I am being an investor, so the least they can do is give me a product if not a long time share as is the case with real investors and all.

So, no I am not doing charity on kick starter and if that's what Kickstarter is about, this charity, then it's basically flawed! I don't think I am asking for much! Idea of free lunch is unacceptable to me and I just hope that's not what Kickstarter is about.

There are non-profit ventures that I've supported on Kickstarter and IndieGoGo and I have never wanted anything in return. That's an entirely different story.

If I back something, I want the product they promised given they didn't fail. If they failed, I am fine with it and I wish them luck w/o any expectations that they would return my money.

Re: Goodbye Popcorn Time

#215

Post by balladeer »

Einstalbert wrote: post #174
DanBC wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You kickstart something because you want to help them make it, not because you want a product in return. While you could strip the copy protections that's a crime.

I'm not sure what is unclear about, "If you donate X, you will receive Y." That's not a simple donation, it's a pre-order.

That's right! I mean there are a lot of people who are considering Kickstarter as a charity. It's not a charity!

It's a funding platform and of course funding does come with the risks of projects failing, founders running away with the money. But, it certainly doesn't have to be a free lunch giveaway as in, "Hey, you wanna start a product/company and be a millionaire? Great! Take my $100 and make merry! No no, I don't want anything in return, I am just doing charity". No thank you sir! If I have to do charity, I know where the drop boxes are.

Re: Goodbye Popcorn Time

#216

Post by fluidcruft »

AnthonyMouse wrote: post #162
mentos wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The future is definitely being able to stream all the shows and movies immediately after release anywhere on the web. I agree, I wonder though if future Hollywood will be more or less profitable. Imagine a future where all movies/tv shows were given away for free/stolen, how would they profit? I think the answer is advertising inside the movie/show. I recently saw this done pretty tastefully in an episode of 'Worka…

> What I think is even more interesting is the fact that advertising, such a wildly inefficient method, right now props up so many industries. What makes you think advertising is inefficient? For specific parties it's extremely efficient. It gives the advertiser the power to change the viewer's preference between Brand X and Brand Y. Allowing himself to be convinced to buy Brand X in exchange for content allows the v…

That's a load of horseshit. I've been seeing ads for things I will never, ever buy forever and apparently Hulu thinks they're going to change that. The advertisers are wasting both their money and my time. I do not gamble and I do not drink. Ain't no amount of playing the same damn ad every break in Hulu that isn't going to make me not hate your company.

Re: Goodbye Popcorn Time

#217

Post by GigabyteCoin »

I don't understand. I thought Popcorn Time was FOSS with it's source on GitHub that downloaded all it's data from external APIs.

How can it possibly just "say goodbye"?

Is this the main developers disowning it or what? I imagine thousands of other devs now have local forks of it on their home machine and can/will continue to develop and release it?

Re: Goodbye Popcorn Time

#218

Post by kayoone »

Believing that piracy is solely a Service problem is pretty naive or downright ignorant. Yes, some people pirate because other means of purchasing the content in question are inferior but lets face it: People will always prefer the free option

Re: Goodbye Popcorn Time

#219

Post by belorn »

j_baker wrote: post #64

> Popcorn Time as a project is legal. We checked. The law isn't quite so black and white. There are a lot of different theories good lawyers can come up with. At the end of the day, the only thing that's legal is what a court says is legal.

Not only is there different theories to the law, but many laws are also very hard to find.

In Sweden for example, the law is not just the law as it is written in the official book. Any work material related to the creation of law also count as law. In the case of the Pirate Bay trial, this is what the prosecutor had to dug out in order to find something that they could accuse the crew of (The working material described an intent to make it illegal to run a service if it is being primary used for illegal purposes). For example, running a pool bar primary used by a biker gang would make the bar illegal to run.

When it comes to highly political sensitive crimes, it not enough to simply buy a book about the law of the land and read it. Somewhere else, there will be a vague sentence that count as law.

Re: Goodbye Popcorn Time

#220

Post by AnthonyMouse »

fluidcruft wrote: post #216
AnthonyMouse wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What I think is even more interesting is the fact that advertising, such a wildly inefficient method, right now props up so many industries. What makes you think advertising is inefficient? For specific parties it's extremely efficient. It gives the advertiser the power to change the viewer's preference between Brand X and Brand Y. Allowing himself to be convinced to buy Brand X in exchange for content allows the v…

That's a load of horseshit. I've been seeing ads for things I will never , ever buy forever and apparently Hulu thinks they're going to change that. The advertisers are wasting both their money and my time. I do not gamble and I do not drink. Ain't no amount of playing the same damn ad every break in Hulu that isn't going to make me not hate your company.

That's just statistics. Some percentage of customers who view an ad -- generally a very large percentage -- will never be swayed by it. But they don't have to be. You don't have to convince very many customers to buy your car instead of the next guy's car, or to switch to your brand of shampoo for the rest of their lives, and you're ahead. Even if 95% of the other people you've paid to put ads in front of never give you a penny.
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