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Amazon's War On The House Of Otto, Germany's $18 Billion Family

forbes.com

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Re: Amazon's War On The House Of Otto, Germany's $18 Billion Family

#21

Post by blurpin »

iwasakabukiman wrote: post #11
trg2 wrote: post #10

The Otto Group’s sales are up 17% in Germany since the recession, while Amazon’s have doubled since 2010. Huh? This comparison confused me. I wonder why the author didn't use the same years? What was the baseline?

I read it as 2010 being the baseline for both, with "since the recession" meaning 2010. But it's fairly ambiguous. It could mean any number of things. It could also be that the numbers for the Otto Group aren't public for whatever reason.

I edited the story. We had to write it this way bc Otto reports a fiscal year that ends in February. Amazon's fiscal year is the calendar year. So it wasn't exact comparison and we had to fudge.

Re: Amazon's War On The House Of Otto, Germany's $18 Billion Family

#22

Post by dictum »

mfrommil wrote: post #7

There's such a strong negative connotation to "burning out" in the article. If an employee puts in a solid 2-3 years and delivers great results for a company, "burns out", and then moves on to a new role or company, is that really that bad? The company (in this case, Amazon) got great results from its employee, the employee had a good experience (and can leverage it to get a promotion, internally or externally). I gu…

> I guess it depends on what employees are looking for in their career - to be the best they can be, or live a laid back lifestyle.

He could no longer see anything, even though their bedroom was covered with the bright light of a sunny day in spring. As if he knew it was time to go, he held his wife's hand tight. Mustering some energy out of nowhere, gasping for air, he said, "I love you." Before she could answer anything, or even acknowledge his sentiment with a stronger grasp of their hands, he added, "but I really wish we'd been better employees".

Re: Amazon's War On The House Of Otto, Germany's $18 Billion Family

#23

Post by nobbyclark »

ed wrote: post #12

(This was nearly impossible to read on mobile) Michael Otto’s family has been as omnipresent in German postwar retail as Wal-Mart, Sears and Target have in the U.S. So what does this 70-year-old patriarch of this $18 billion clan most want to talk about? A factory in Bangladesh. With gusto he describes how he and Nobel Peace Prize- winner Muhammad Yunus hatched a plan to build a humane clothing factory, where all pro…

Whatever mobile ad / paywall BS Forbes is up to, that needs to stop now. Worst mobile ad ever

Re: Amazon's War On The House Of Otto, Germany's $18 Billion Family

#24

Post by PythonicAlpha »

mxfh wrote: post #9

If you see how Hermes Group, an Otto owned logistics company, (sub-)subcontractors have to handle their daily work load at (often below) minimum wage pay, often with their private cars, it's hard to believe he's that serious about running a morally superior business for any other reason than getting good PR. DHL is not golden either but Hermes is just bad in every aspect. As a private customer in Germany I would try…

I agree. I think, today's Otto Group is not morally superior to Amazon's business at all, at least judged by their Hermes business. At least, I can not see any viable differences.

What totally pisses me off is, the aura of "charity" that Otto is surrounding around himself. He also got a high German medal (the so called "Große Verdienstkreuz mit Stern") for his charities. With examples like these, German high medals become the same value as the "Nobel Peace Prize" that is given to some of the worst persons that have lived.

I now understand, why some people strictly refuse to be dishonored by such prizes.

Re: Amazon's War On The House Of Otto, Germany's $18 Billion Family

#25

Post by mAritz »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #19
anentropic wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Amazon warehouses shouldn't become the sweatshops of tomorrow" They already are... http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-25034598 http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b03k5kzp/Panorama_Amazo... http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2013/dec/01/week-amazo...

I'm aware. I have more faith in the German government protecting its citizens compared to the US government.

As mentioned in the article, it isn't really. There were mass protests by amazon employees in Germany last year. I don't know if anything really changed since then, but I kind of doubt it.

Re: Amazon's War On The House Of Otto, Germany's $18 Billion Family

#27

Post by atmosx »

Did the guy (Otto) pay for front-cover or did Forbes randomly picked up a successful billionaire who made up himself in the period of the German economic miracle?

I mean, there's nothing attractive to this story: Amazon is bad on workers and Otto is good, won't get you far. Especially in the Anglo-saxon world.

Re: Amazon's War On The House Of Otto, Germany's $18 Billion Family

#28

Post by PythonicAlpha »

aridiculous wrote: post #2

I wonder how much of Otto's benevolence is being played up in the article (discouraging weekend working, tolerance of gigantic strategic failures). If he truly does what he's saying, it sounds like a very pleasant and productive place to work.

I do not agree with Otto's benevolence. I think it is just show. When you see what he is doing with his Hermes business, he is not benevolent at all but throws many people even deeper into despair.

There was also a documentary about his life-ruining business but the big "benefactor" just found covering slogans to disguise what it is really about: To rip people off. When his other businesses work the same, than it is a big benevolence show. Of course the German government bought the show (why not, our politicians are of the same kind!).

Re: Amazon's War On The House Of Otto, Germany's $18 Billion Family

#29

Post by jordan0day »

mfrommil wrote: post #7

There's such a strong negative connotation to "burning out" in the article. If an employee puts in a solid 2-3 years and delivers great results for a company, "burns out", and then moves on to a new role or company, is that really that bad? The company (in this case, Amazon) got great results from its employee, the employee had a good experience (and can leverage it to get a promotion, internally or externally). I gu…

There's such a strong negative connotation to "burning out" because it is a strongly negative thing.

There's a big difference between "burning out" and "eh, I'm getting kind of tired of this, I wonder what else is out there..."

Re: Amazon's War On The House Of Otto, Germany's $18 Billion Family

#30

Post by jmngomes »

PythonicAlpha wrote: post #24
mxfh wrote: post #9

If you see how Hermes Group, an Otto owned logistics company, (sub-)subcontractors have to handle their daily work load at (often below) minimum wage pay, often with their private cars, it's hard to believe he's that serious about running a morally superior business for any other reason than getting good PR. DHL is not golden either but Hermes is just bad in every aspect. As a private customer in Germany I would try…

I agree. I think, today's Otto Group is not morally superior to Amazon's business at all, at least judged by their Hermes business. At least, I can not see any viable differences. What totally pisses me off is, the aura of "charity" that Otto is surrounding around himself. He also got a high German medal (the so called "Große Verdienstkreuz mit Stern") for his charities. With examples like these, German high medals b…

> What totally pisses me off is, the aura of "charity" that Otto is surrounding around himself.

Agreed; we need an equivalent to "greenwashing" to describe this behaviour...

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