For what it's worth here's a whitehouse petition.
https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/release-senate-int...
Yes, The CIA Spied On Congress
51–60 of 98 posts
Re: Yes, The CIA Spied On Congress
#52How far does a government agency have to go in breaking law before the military is deployed to put boots on the ground to reel in the agency back under the rule of law? I'd like to think that if agencies started hiring their own armies and created their own version of law enforcement zones from other countries, and started killing people who opposed them, that someone would actually do something to stop that... right…
It would be the FBI, as the military cannot be used for internal policing functions.
The http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Insurrection_Act might apply in that case.
Re: Yes, The CIA Spied On Congress
#53So the CIA Illegally Spied on the Congress Staffers investigating illegal CIA Torture Methods? ------illegality recursion too deep----------- But seriously this is a critical test for Pres. Obama. These agencies shouldn't be allowed to pull this kind of Shit without suffering serious consequences. Time for the Executive to step-up, fire a bunch of high-rankers and NOT sweep this under the carpet as some sort of "Bad…
> But seriously this is a critical test for Pres. Obama. A critical test? He doesn't have enough power to do anything about it. He can't even get rid of Guantanamo, which was central to his campaign. His response to the Snowden leaks was entirely supportive of the intelligence community, against the general public's perception of what happened. A political figure like him supporting Snowden would have made a massive…
Immediately after Obama won his presidential election in 2008, this was one webcomic's take on Obama's promise of "Change":
Re: Yes, The CIA Spied On Congress
#54Earlier quoted context omitted.
>> A critical test? He doesn't have enough power to do anything about it. If this is indeed true, then it would mean that the US political system (which is regarded as the best example of democracy, globally) is corrupt from the core and the idea of checks & balances is completely bogus. If this is case, and if we as (Americans? people?) tolerate it, then I guess it's our implicit way of saying "corruption is indeed…
>> A critical test? He doesn't have enough power to do anything about it. > If this is indeed true, then it would mean that the US political system (which is regarded as the best example of democracy, globally) is corrupt from the core and the idea of checks & balances is completely bogus. Ever since someone asked me if I thought GWB was "a good president", I've been mildly interested in what the president is (a) sup…
Douglas Adams satirised precisely this point with his Zaphod Beeblebrox character in Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy. To quote wikipedia[1], his was "a role that involves no power whatsoever, and merely requires the incumbent to attract attention so no one wonders who's really in charge, a role for which Zaphod was perfectly suited"
Re: Yes, The CIA Spied On Congress
#55Earlier quoted context omitted.
> But seriously this is a critical test for Pres. Obama. A critical test? He doesn't have enough power to do anything about it. He can't even get rid of Guantanamo, which was central to his campaign. His response to the Snowden leaks was entirely supportive of the intelligence community, against the general public's perception of what happened. A political figure like him supporting Snowden would have made a massive…
>> A critical test? He doesn't have enough power to do anything about it. If this is indeed true, then it would mean that the US political system (which is regarded as the best example of democracy, globally) is corrupt from the core and the idea of checks & balances is completely bogus. If this is case, and if we as (Americans? people?) tolerate it, then I guess it's our implicit way of saying "corruption is indeed…
> If this is indeed true, then it would mean that the US political system (which is regarded as the best example of democracy, globally) [...].
Come again?! Where did this come from, Hollywood?
Re: Yes, The CIA Spied On Congress
#56Earlier quoted context omitted.
> But seriously this is a critical test for Pres. Obama. A critical test? He doesn't have enough power to do anything about it. He can't even get rid of Guantanamo, which was central to his campaign. His response to the Snowden leaks was entirely supportive of the intelligence community, against the general public's perception of what happened. A political figure like him supporting Snowden would have made a massive…
>> A critical test? He doesn't have enough power to do anything about it. If this is indeed true, then it would mean that the US political system (which is regarded as the best example of democracy, globally) is corrupt from the core and the idea of checks & balances is completely bogus. If this is case, and if we as (Americans? people?) tolerate it, then I guess it's our implicit way of saying "corruption is indeed…
> US political system (which is regarded as the best example of democracy, globally)
> regarded best globally
Excuse me?
Re: Yes, The CIA Spied On Congress
#57Earlier quoted context omitted.
> But seriously this is a critical test for Pres. Obama. A critical test? He doesn't have enough power to do anything about it. He can't even get rid of Guantanamo, which was central to his campaign. His response to the Snowden leaks was entirely supportive of the intelligence community, against the general public's perception of what happened. A political figure like him supporting Snowden would have made a massive…
>> A critical test? He doesn't have enough power to do anything about it. If this is indeed true, then it would mean that the US political system (which is regarded as the best example of democracy, globally) is corrupt from the core and the idea of checks & balances is completely bogus. If this is case, and if we as (Americans? people?) tolerate it, then I guess it's our implicit way of saying "corruption is indeed…
"[US political system] which is regarded as the best example of democracy, globally"
err, what? As a foreigner living in the US for the last 5 years I will tell you this: The US political system is regarded as the best example of democracy, by they Americans only. Period.
Having lived and traveled in Europe for the most part of my 30 years of my adult life I have heard no person having this perception of the American political system. In fact, I would say that it is closer to the truth to claim that the American political system is regarded as corrupted, like most of other political systems globally.
I really don't want to hijack the thread but I am kind of tired of this perception that some Americans have of themselves and their country that is ("regarded as") the best democracy in the world.
The american democracy is a representative democracy powered mainly by two private funded right-wing Christian parties.
Not to mention that this political system cannot provide to it's citizens and tax payers the right to public education and public health care.
Anyways, yes in my opinion, it would not be a surprise at all if CIA spied on Congress or if the President (or better the USA CEO) could not do anything about it.
Re: Yes, The CIA Spied On Congress
#58Earlier quoted context omitted.
>> A critical test? He doesn't have enough power to do anything about it. If this is indeed true, then it would mean that the US political system (which is regarded as the best example of democracy, globally) is corrupt from the core and the idea of checks & balances is completely bogus. If this is case, and if we as (Americans? people?) tolerate it, then I guess it's our implicit way of saying "corruption is indeed…
"[US political system] which is regarded as the best example of democracy, globally" err, what? As a foreigner living in the US for the last 5 years I will tell you this: The US political system is regarded as the best example of democracy, by they Americans only. Period. Having lived and traveled in Europe for the most part of my 30 years of my adult life I have heard no person having this perception of the American…
> "[US political system] which is regarded as the best example of democracy, globally"
As far as I can tell, Switzerland has the best political system (with the most direct democracy) and it's really a shame that nobody seems to want to imitate it (which of course can be explained by the fact that it means more power goes to the People, not corporations/secret gvt agencies/etc, which are often allowed to buy politicians via "donations", accepted corruption called "lobbying", etc)
Re: Yes, The CIA Spied On Congress
#59Earlier quoted context omitted.
>> A critical test? He doesn't have enough power to do anything about it. If this is indeed true, then it would mean that the US political system (which is regarded as the best example of democracy, globally) is corrupt from the core and the idea of checks & balances is completely bogus. If this is case, and if we as (Americans? people?) tolerate it, then I guess it's our implicit way of saying "corruption is indeed…
> If this is indeed true, then it would mean that the US political system ( which is regarded as the best example of democracy, globally ) [...]. Come again?! Where did this come from, Hollywood?
just look around you. Surely I'm not the first person to mention this concept to you. I'm not saying I believe that the US has the best example of democracy, but true or not, that's the general story being "sold" on the news (and yes, in movies as well).
Re: Yes, The CIA Spied On Congress
#60Earlier quoted context omitted.
>> A critical test? He doesn't have enough power to do anything about it. If this is indeed true, then it would mean that the US political system (which is regarded as the best example of democracy, globally) is corrupt from the core and the idea of checks & balances is completely bogus. If this is case, and if we as (Americans? people?) tolerate it, then I guess it's our implicit way of saying "corruption is indeed…
"[US political system] which is regarded as the best example of democracy, globally" err, what? As a foreigner living in the US for the last 5 years I will tell you this: The US political system is regarded as the best example of democracy, by they Americans only. Period. Having lived and traveled in Europe for the most part of my 30 years of my adult life I have heard no person having this perception of the American…
You (and many others) are having a knee-jerk reaction to what I said. I'm not saying that the US has the best example of democracy (and based on the rest of my post, you would think that would have come across).
What I am saying is that there is a widespread public perception that "America knows best" — the news supports this, Hollywood supports this, and yes, loads of people around the globe support this notion as well.
Please tell me I'm not the one bursting your bubble on this one.
Now what you mention about having lived in Europe/other countries: I hear you. I've lived in other countries as well (Spain, Costa Rica, and a brief stint in Saudi Arabia). Everyone in all of these countries talks shit about the US. It's the cool thing to do. Like us talking shit about Facebook.
But what do they want come their birthdays? Xboxes! Call of Duty! Pizza and Coca Cola!
There is a deeply imbued adoration for America as a model of "all that a country can aspire to be" — and this image is what I'm referring to.
[EDIT:
you know, I knew since this was the internet, someone was going to bring up the whole "hey, did you know pizza is italian". Yes, I did. And as people from NYC or Chicago can tell you, the US has created it's own version which has taken on its own fame.
But while we're on it, did you know that French Fries aren't actually from France?
And to those who are going to take what I said as "because I buy these products I endorse America" , you have clearly missed the broader message of my post.
It's not about the specifics of Coke, Xbox, or fast food (I can't believe I actually have to explain this but, wait, yes I can). It's the overall "image" that America sells overseas. It's the reason why Hollywood movies are popular all around the world, yet not as much the other way around. Again, that is just ONE example, so no need to hyper focus on just that. The fact is, there's an undeniable adoration of American culture abroad --- and it exists RIGHT ALONGSIDE the contempt and disgust for American culture abroad.]