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At Apple shareholder’s meeting, Tim Cook tells off climate change deniers

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Re: At Apple shareholder’s meeting, Tim Cook tells off climate change deniers

#91

"Climate Change Denier" is a term coined by radical environmentalists in an attempt to paint their opponents as crazy and stupid. Most rational people don't deny that climate change is occurring. Many people simply side with scientists that have examined the facts and determined that human attempts at trying to control climate change are about as effective as Indian rain dances. That said, Tim Cook's response was cor…

[deleted]

Re: At Apple shareholder’s meeting, Tim Cook tells off climate change deniers

#92
This group, NCPPR, has a long history of not only denying climate science [1] by misconstruing their sources [2], but also defending the tobacco industry [3] and denying involvement in corruption scandals [4].

1. http://www.nationalcenter.org/NPA388.html

2. http://www.sciencemag.org/content/295/5554/476.abstract

http://web.archive.org/web/20050414163144/http://www.nature....

http://web.archive.org/web/20050414163147/http://www.nature....

3. http://web.archive.org/web/20030930182136/http://www.prwatch...

http://www.nationalcenter.org/NPA198.html

4. http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&sid=a9s0n...

http://www.chron.com/news/nation-world/article/Think-tank-he...

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/06/23/politics/23indian.html?_r=...

Re: At Apple shareholder’s meeting, Tim Cook tells off climate change deniers

#93
post #73

I'm really sceptical and suspicious to the type of environmental policies that Apple and other companies do. The effect on global warming is near zero, possibly even negative. The decision to use green energy decreases the price of non-green energy, so other companies will buy more of it. I really don't like how unsystematic and non-transparent this approach is. A clean solution would be a tax on non-green energy. It…

There are already plenty of taxes on 'non-green' energy, but the demand curve is inelastic so they make little difference. Nearly every country on the planet has taxes on liquid fuels, for example. Heavily taxing energy for any reasons always leads to lower economic growth and unemployment. That is because no tax applies globally, so there are always places to move to access the cheapest energy. And usually the place…

I'm curious about the factories that are supposed to have closed due to Australia's carbon tax and I'd be especially interested to see some evidence if these factories 'relocating'.

Trade exposed heavy industry was largely sheltered from the tax. In fact some argued the free permits were actually going to deliver windfall profits. There was a story recently about the closure of Alcoa's Point Henry aluminium smelter, but the company denied there was any link to the carbon tax.

Re: At Apple shareholder’s meeting, Tim Cook tells off climate change deniers

#94

How much of Apple stock does NCPPR own anyway? Amusing to see that nowhere in its long whiny press release does it announce that it will divest itself of AAPL. Whatever happened to putting your money where your mouth is or voting with your feet?

It's always hilarious to watch supposed champions of the free market fail to let the money do the talking.

Re: At Apple shareholder’s meeting, Tim Cook tells off climate change deniers

#95
post #15

"Climate Change Denier" is a term coined by radical environmentalists in an attempt to paint their opponents as crazy and stupid. Most rational people don't deny that climate change is occurring. Many people simply side with scientists that have examined the facts and determined that human attempts at trying to control climate change are about as effective as Indian rain dances. That said, Tim Cook's response was cor…

Including the founder of Greenpeace http://www.independent.co.uk/environment/climate-change/gree...

Rather amusingly, that article quotes Moore as chewing someone out for using weasel-words, yet he's using plenty of them himself.

Re: At Apple shareholder’s meeting, Tim Cook tells off climate change deniers

#96

"Climate Change Denier" is a term coined by radical environmentalists in an attempt to paint their opponents as crazy and stupid. Most rational people don't deny that climate change is occurring. Many people simply side with scientists that have examined the facts and determined that human attempts at trying to control climate change are about as effective as Indian rain dances. That said, Tim Cook's response was cor…

"Climate change denier" refers solely to those who deny the scientific fact of anthropogenic global warming. It's not used to describe those who accept the science but doubt the efficacy or wisdom of the proposed solutions.

I'm actually with you on doubting the ability of public policy to deal with it. We aren't going to stop it, and we will suffer from it. Our only option is to figure out how to adapt to it.

Re: At Apple shareholder’s meeting, Tim Cook tells off climate change deniers

#97
post #75
post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No serious environmentalist I've read believes that misconception. In my view, that's another form of denial. Not the organized PR-flack fraud in the style originated by the tobacco industry, but just the normal human kind of wanting to ignore anything personally inconvenient.

I absolutely do not want to put off anyone from environmental work or a global call to change and stop of pollution and other unsustainable activities. But the fact remains that enough damage has been done that the consequences will be felt for a century, even if we turn around this ship tomorrow.

Sure. Today we're dealing with the environmental consequences of decisions made a century ago. E.g., water policy, urban planning, transport policy, effects of industry. Nature of the beast, really.

Re: At Apple shareholder’s meeting, Tim Cook tells off climate change deniers

#98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> this group [does not deny] that climate change is occurring But their press release says > Apple is wasting untold amounts of shareholder money to combat so-called climate change. which sounds like denial to me. Would you prefer to call them "Climate Change Skeptics," the term coined by radical conservatives to attempt to paint themselves as not crazy and anti-scientific? Everyone plays the "name yourself according…

"Climate change" used to be "global warming" until that term became so strongly associated with extremists that it instantly damaged the credibility of anyone that used it. "Climate Change Skeptics" communicates the same thing as "deniers". You are missing the point. Most people agree that climate change (aka global warming) is occurring. The argument is over whether we can cause it or stop it.

Both terms have been in use for a long time. When Frank Luntz was a republican strategist he suggested the party use "climate change" exclusively because he believed it sounded less threatening.

http://www.skepticalscience.com/print.php?r=326

Re: At Apple shareholder’s meeting, Tim Cook tells off climate change deniers

#99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Investors are not panicked. I argue that a panicked investor will either: I) Sell his stock immediately. or II) Demand any information available. Since (I) is not happening on a large scale (even when it dropped in January volume was a small portion of total shares), it follows that if investors are panicked about the stock, (II) must be occuring. However, (II) is not occuring because only 2.95% of shareholders voted…

"Apple's stock price has fallen by 40% over the past six months, vaporizing almost $300 billion of market value." Source: http://www.businessinsider.com/two-charts-show-why-apple-sto...

That's almost a year old.

Re: At Apple shareholder’s meeting, Tim Cook tells off climate change deniers

#100

If liberals really cared about climate change, we would all be using nuclear power and Obama would not have cut Bush's program to develop fuel cell cars.

Do you think:

- "Liberals" is a group of people who all think the same way.

- The only reason nuclear power isn't widely used is "Liberals not caring about climate change".

?

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