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"Free-to-play" misleading advertising in Europe

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Re: "Free-to-play" misleading advertising in Europe

#91

Post by zobzu »

x0054 wrote: post #11

The solution for this would be to change the purchase approval model where you have to enter your password to purchase anything. You can have to options: 1) authorize until closed, or 2) authorize just this purchase. This way kids could not run up charges using iAP. However, if you an adult, and you have purchased $100s of iAP, and now you feel bad about it, I have 0 sympathy for you. Overall, this is just EU being E…

EU doesn't care about capitalism as much as the USA and the like-minded.

It cares about setting proper expectations: you're going to have to pay to finish the game/really use the app.

I think that's not a bad idea to mark it clearly as such.

Re: "Free-to-play" misleading advertising in Europe

#92

Post by Dewie »

brudgers wrote: post #55
nnutter wrote: post #18

Personally I would like to see iAP to be considered like advertising and for it to be more heavily regulated at child audiences. Tired of my 4 year old crying because I won't let him spend another $4 to unlock another widget.

Next time a child asks for permission to make an in app purchase, turn off the electronics go down to the creek and jump in puddles together. They are only four once. It's right now or it doesn't happen. There's no second chance.

Kids should have a childhood like I experienced/like I wanted, or else it will be a wasted childhood.

I don't think that kids should play a lot of video games (I don't know what they should or should not do, since I'm not a child development expert). But this whole adults looking back at their "organic" childhood as the one true way to grow up ever is getting kind of old.

Lego? Damnit, take those silly toys away from him and give 'em a garn and let them make up their own games. I tell you these advanced toys destroys the natural creativity of children. Give 'em a stick and some garn and they will make up their own games; that's how kids are SUPPOSED to be.

Re: "Free-to-play" misleading advertising in Europe

#93

Post by djur »

dreamdu5t wrote: post #80
djur wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The difference is which group derives its power from the consent of the governed, actually.

Nobody alive today has ever consented to government. There is no negotiation. "Consent of the governed" is sophistry.

The people have the right to vote in whatever government they want. If that right is abridged or taken away, they can kill the people doing that until the right is restored.

That is the consent of the governed.

Re: "Free-to-play" misleading advertising in Europe

#94

Post by ericdykstra »

Seems kind of ridiculous to me.

"Consumers and in particular children need better protection against unexpected costs from in-app purchases."

What are unexpected costs? Are users ever charged without explicitly agreeing to it?

"The use of the word 'free' (or similar unequivocal terms) as such, and without any appropriate qualifications, should only be allowed for games which are indeed free in their entirety, or in other words which contain no possibility of making in-app purchases, not even on an optional basis."

What is the cost of someone downloading a 'free' game only to realize that they need to pay to get the experience that they expected? They can just uninstall the game. I've paid for and downloaded games that didn't deliver the experience I expected.

If the goal is protecting kids from making in-app purchases, maybe parents should learn how to use parental controls, or not attach credit cards to their children's devices. Does this really 'protect' anyone, or does it just change the language that game-makers use for this model, and nothing else?

Re: "Free-to-play" misleading advertising in Europe

#95

Post by dmoo »

dreamdu5t wrote: post #80
djur wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The difference is which group derives its power from the consent of the governed, actually.

Nobody alive today has ever consented to government. There is no negotiation. "Consent of the governed" is sophistry.

From time to time people withdraw that consent, like in the Ukraine at the moment.

Re: "Free-to-play" misleading advertising in Europe

#96

Post by zik »

taspeotis wrote: post #8

When I look at free games on the App Store I see if it says "offers in-app purchases". If it does I look at the in-app purchases. If the in-app purchases are "x00 Special In-Game Currency Units" then I don't install the game. Not sure we need legislation to avoid being ripped off...

Unlike the US, the EU has strong legislation against deceptive advertising. Saying that a game is "free" when it's designed for profit is intentionally deceptive. It's really as simple as that.

Re: "Free-to-play" misleading advertising in Europe

#97

Post by masklinn »

taspeotis wrote: post #8

When I look at free games on the App Store I see if it says "offers in-app purchases". If it does I look at the in-app purchases. If the in-app purchases are "x00 Special In-Game Currency Units" then I don't install the game. Not sure we need legislation to avoid being ripped off...

> If the in-app purchases are "x00 Special In-Game Currency Units" then I don't install the game.

That's sensible to false-positives though, a number of games are perfectly playable (with no roadblock) without getting special currency units, e.g. jetpack joyride (a fairly standard infinite runner) or Solomon's Boneyard. The currency units are mostly there for developer support and if you can't be arsed to play the game (for some reason).

Re: "Free-to-play" misleading advertising in Europe

#98

Post by kiiski »

baddox wrote: post #43
jkrems wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think anybody was saying that games should be free or that iAPs are about to be illegal. But labeling something "free" that isn't really "free" is misleading customers. Games shouldn't be free since games aren't free to produce. But it's a reasonable expectation that games that are not free are not labeled as "free".

How can you claim that this is a reasonable expectation, when the most popular and top grossing games on all platforms for several years have been dominated by so-called "free" games with in-app purchases? For someone to expect "free" to mean "no in-app purchases" would require complete ignorance on the state of electronic gaming, which is hardly reasonable.

It might be "hardly reasonable" to you, but most people _are_ completely ignorant about the state of electronic gaming. The article itself clearly says that complains about this have became common enough that EC needs to take action. So it happens and is common. That is a fact, not an assumption. The only question is whether to allow it, or try to find a solution.

Personally I would like games with in app purchases to be in the "paid" category with a price "0" (or "0+"). Maybe even include how much the average player pays for it. I don't much care whether this is achieved through regulations, or done by companies themselves.

Re: "Free-to-play" misleading advertising in Europe

#99

Post by MortenK »

jasonlotito wrote: post #50
mikhailt wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But outside of games just not being playable, people are talking about not having fun without the IAP. This is fairly subjective. I didn't spend a dime on Plant's vs. Zombies 2 despite it having IAP, yet somehow people suggest you "have" to spend money to have fun. You didn't clarify that in your original post here. If I understood this is what you meant then I would've edited my post to remove the "fun" part but r…

> "You didn't clarify that in your original post here." What? That was literally in reply to your post which I replied to. "Their free app of the week is often so-called free games but they almost always have in-app purchases that's required to actually enjoy the game." You were talking about enjoyment from the beginning. > Yes, it is in this point we're making Not sure you know what point you are making. Sorry, I'm…

You are the one here acting like a troll. You come off as argumentative to the point of combative. You nitpick and swear, all in a highly unpleasant tone. If you really are done, great, the discussion will be better off.

Re: "Free-to-play" misleading advertising in Europe

#100

Post by tolmasky »

zik wrote: post #96
taspeotis wrote: post #8

When I look at free games on the App Store I see if it says "offers in-app purchases". If it does I look at the in-app purchases. If the in-app purchases are "x00 Special In-Game Currency Units" then I don't install the game. Not sure we need legislation to avoid being ripped off...

Unlike the US, the EU has strong legislation against deceptive advertising. Saying that a game is "free" when it's designed for profit is intentionally deceptive. It's really as simple as that.

Games with ads are free but designed for profit. Is that misleading too?
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