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Curse Of The Gifted (2000)

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Re: Curse Of The Gifted (2000)

#311

Post by gizzlon »

bane wrote: post #244
doctorstupid wrote: post #240

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "the kinds of problems most people have seem trivially simple to me" From this I can tell that you're smart, but not really smart. The really smart never say things like that.

Can you provide an example of a typical problem most people have that's not trivially solvable by "don't do the thing that causes you to have the problem?" There's literally hundreds of thousands of pages of advice columns and books and lectures you can go to about various typical money/relationship problems which make up the vast bulk of people's issues which are all summed up with the above. Problem: I don't make e…

But none of those are solutions.. you've solved nothing.

"Whenever I start feeling sick, I just stop being sick and be awesome instead" - Barney Stinson

Re: Curse Of The Gifted (2000)

#312

Post by [deleted] »

cosmie wrote: post #81
ToastyMallows wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Believe me I've been there before. My point was rather that I think the person who was giving the test was wrong to offer that students use calculators.

I believe the parent was referring to the AP Calculus exam, based off of his 2 out of 5 score[1]. For non-Americans, AP exams are standardized tests administered by the College Board (company behind the SAT university entrance exams)[2]. Most universities will accept passing AP exam scores as the equivalent college credit (e.g. a score of 3/5 is usually accepted as college credit for Calculus I). AP Exams/Courses are…

[deleted]

Re: Curse Of The Gifted (2000)

#313

Post by ndeine »

lutusp wrote: post #282
akavi wrote: post #281

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Uh, don't most students take calculus senior year of high school?

In the U.S.? Not really. This source -- http://nces.ed.gov/fastfacts/display.asp?id=97 -- says that in 2009, just 16% of U.S. high school students took calculus. And a common complaint by college professors is that high school calculus courses teach rote procedures without explaining calculus in any depth -- the students know how to solve calculus problems, but they don't actually understand the subject.

That's my perspective on it. I first took calculus as a junior in high school, and the majority of it boiled down to memorizing what the derivative of `x` type of function is and what the integral of `y` type of function is.

When the AP test rolled around I was really struck. The problems were about the flow rate of water descending into a tank and what happens when you put a drain here with this rate of flow, etc. Completely different from our earlier problems which could be solved by rote memorization. And from my perspective - one of a student who knew a bunch of calculus "rules" but lacked understanding of how calculus really worked - this was incredibly difficult.

I got a 3, which is passing, but opted to take beginner-level engineer's calculus when I got to college anyway. Even if you "learn" calculus in high school, it does not teach the level of mathematical maturity required to understand the higher level manipulations. This kind of thought is the foundation for any good engineer, and I have no regrets about retaking the course.

Re: Curse Of The Gifted (2000)

#314

Post by ghost_IV »

SomeCallMeTim wrote: post #196
bunderbunder wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have never, ever, ever met someone who was well-served by skipping a grade. Myself included. Ever. Skipping a grade means giving up a full year of education. If that proposition doesn't give you pause, you probably don't have enough respect for the value of education. Even if you you get absolutely nothing out of that year aside from the soft skills you develop by sitting in a class with other kids and listening to…

>you probably don't have enough respect for the value of education I have absolutely no respect for the current educational system. The grades kids usually skip are teaching 90% review every year , and skipping one just lets you get out of that worthless grind sooner. I've known multiple adults who skipped grades as kids, and all have said it was a good thing. What can mess things up is throwing a kid into a group of…

+1

Re: Curse Of The Gifted (2000)

#315

Post by mathattack »

darkandbrooding wrote: post #63
mathattack wrote: post #34

There are now lots of articles suggesting praising people for effort rather than intelligence. Seems like Raymond was ahead of the curve. 2 examples of many: [1] http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/educationnews/9862693/P... [2] http://consumer.healthday.com/kids-health-information-23/chi...

"Nothing in the world can take the place of Persistence. Talent will not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful men with talent. Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not; the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent. The slogan 'Press On' has solved and always will solve the problems of the human race." Calvin Coolidge 30th president…

I've read a lot of quotes like this, but I used to wonder, "Is this just people downplaying all the other things that led to their success, like family money?" It's interesting that modern psychology is providing some proof as to why these quotes are true.

Re: Curse Of The Gifted (2000)

#316

Post by [deleted] »

bane wrote: post #234
Crake wrote: post #225

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with most of what you're saying, except for "every single person's money problem is solved with the very simple 'don't spend more than you earn.'" Sometimes it's not being able to earn enough money that's the problem--there's a baseline level of income needed to pay for very basic no frills food and rent in any given area.

> Sometimes it's not being able to earn enough money that's the problem This is going to come across as prickish, I'm not meaning it with that tone, but here's an example: 1) Costs are more than income? Earn more money. 2) "But where I live has a shitty economy and there are no jobs that pay more that I'm qualified for" Then your options are: move to someplace with better pay potential, work more jobs, downsize your…

[deleted]

Re: Curse Of The Gifted (2000)

#317

Post by kayoone »

bane wrote: post #276
thesimpsons1022 wrote: post #272

Earlier quoted context omitted.

thats fine if you come from a perfect background but it sounds pretty ignorant, like you have no empathy for others and can't relate to others situations. for example, if you fucked up as a kid, but want to turn your life around it can be really difficult/impossible. furthermore, life can throw unavoidable things at people, like maybe they had to take care of a sick relative instead of getting an education. you sound…

I appreciate your comment and the spirit it was presented in. You should dig back through my comment history to find out more about my background. The TL;DR, grew up pretty poor, came out of that environment with lots of burdens, did exactly what I said above and now am not poor anymore. It sucked, hard , but it's possible. And it's more possible to do it before you make lots of bad decisions that make it even harder…

Other people could give you the same advice in regards to your weight problems. It sucks, its hard, but its possible. Its not complex, but its not always easy. Still you struggle and its complex for you. So why are you so judgemental about other peoples seemingly simple problems ?

Re: Curse Of The Gifted (2000)

#318

Post by j2kun »

gizmo686 wrote: post #189
j2kun wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is very rare for an incoming calculus student to know algebra. In fact, I often tell my students that the first goal of college-level calculus is to make them actually learn algebra. It's an extremely sad state of affairs for me (a mathematician). Relevant (an article I wrote): http://j2kun.svbtle.com/you-never-did-math-in-high-school

My high school curriculum was deliberately set up so that Calculus is where we really learn algebra. 9th and 10th grade were designed to teach mathematical thinking. In 11th grade you have the choice of taking 11th grade math or Calc 1 (with permission of your 10th grade math teacher), both of which would instill algebra (technically, you are aloud to take any math elective, but I think everyone takes at least one of…

That sounds fantastic.

I agree there is some baseline level of rote manipulation people can't get away with, but it's gone too far.

Re: Curse Of The Gifted (2000)

#320

Post by larsmak »

SwellJoe wrote: post #82
S4M wrote: post #33

Is the reply of Torvalds online somewhere?

Someone else mentioned that ESR got no reply, and the thread continued on another path. So, Linus did not reply, it seems. But, he did begin using revision control soon after; though I think that's likely to have happened, anyway.

Not only did he start using revision control - he went ahead and implemented a completely new one!
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