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IBM layoffs strike first in India; workers describe as 'slaughter' and 'massive'

wraltechwire.com

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Re: IBM layoffs strike first in India; workers describe as 'slaughter' and 'massive'

#51

Post by PakG1 »

mjn wrote: post #26
smoyer wrote: post #5

I don't want to seem insensitive but ... The quote at the beginning of the article describes pretty much every layoff I've ever seen (or been through). The person quoted describes it as inhuman, but HR and managers are told to keep it impersonal (don't induce more crying than there is). You don't get notice (on purpose), you have to turn in company-owned property and they want you out the door (it affects the morale…

> the severance and extended benefits are far more generous than any layoff I've been through here in the states Interesting. Are big tech companies less generous than big engineering firms in other fields? When companies like BP, Boeing, etc. have had layoff rounds, 3 months is just about the minimum package for an involuntary termination, and it's common to first offer much higher voluntary packages to reduce headc…

When IBM did their layoff action in 2013, people in Australia received 2 weeks pay for every year they had worked at IBM. I was there, saw those people leave, saw what they got offered. Was really sad about it because one guy in particular was possibly the best project manager for our department in all of the Asia Pacific region. They gave the most critical projects to this guy. He worked hellish hours to get a severely important project done, as well as managing the network program (project portfolio). Email was sent out that he'd go on a well-deserved extended vacation, and when he came back, he'd be reassigned to another critical role now that everything in Network and other stuff are under control. When he came back, he got his 2 weeks pay per year worked. That really pissed me off. If you're going to fire people, fire the worst guy, not the best guy. He was capable of doing the work of 3 project managers.

Re: IBM layoffs strike first in India; workers describe as 'slaughter' and 'massive'

#52

Post by iends »

smackfu wrote: post #36
smoyer wrote: post #5

I don't want to seem insensitive but ... The quote at the beginning of the article describes pretty much every layoff I've ever seen (or been through). The person quoted describes it as inhuman, but HR and managers are told to keep it impersonal (don't induce more crying than there is). You don't get notice (on purpose), you have to turn in company-owned property and they want you out the door (it affects the morale…

>the severance and extended benefits are far more generous than any layoff I've been through here in the states. IBM is pretty generous with the severance in the US too. Something like a week's pay per 6 months worked, capped at 26 weeks. If you've been working there a while, that's a half year of salary. Plus there is generally a month notice, in theory so you can find another job internally.

> Plus there is generally a month notice, in theory so you can find another job internally.

This is not really the case, it seems there is usually a hiring freeze for the month between when people were notified and when people are let go.

Re: IBM layoffs strike first in India; workers describe as 'slaughter' and 'massive'

#53

Post by cwaniak »

smoyer wrote: post #5

I don't want to seem insensitive but ... The quote at the beginning of the article describes pretty much every layoff I've ever seen (or been through). The person quoted describes it as inhuman, but HR and managers are told to keep it impersonal (don't induce more crying than there is). You don't get notice (on purpose), you have to turn in company-owned property and they want you out the door (it affects the morale…

I think you nailed it yourself. Here is the message you get every day for years while working for big-corpo like IBM: > YOU'RE PART OF A BUSINESS

And here is your "thank you": > You don't get notice (on purpose), you have to turn in company-owned property and they want you out the door

Why you IBM would or any other big-corpo follows this scheme of laying people off is beyond me.

Re: IBM layoffs strike first in India; workers describe as 'slaughter' and 'massive'

#54

Post by lmm »

ScottWhigham wrote: post #44
victor27 wrote: post #38

The 3 months of compensation mentioned here - is equivalent only to 1.5 months in any other country. So not overtly generous. I'm sure their employment contracts mention 1-2 months of salary in event of termination (or a similar notice period in case the employee wants to leave) - so this is not more than committed. (In India the "Base Salary" component is often 50% of FIXED compensation, not including bonuses. This…

1.5 months salary is still generous though, no?

Maybe for a developing country. Here in Europe I'd expect 3 months' full salary as a minimum.

Re: IBM layoffs strike first in India; workers describe as 'slaughter' and 'massive'

#55

Post by josefresco »

PakG1 wrote: post #46

I have perhaps a unique perspective on this, as I was part of IBM in Asia and left in November 2013. I witnessed the 2013 layoff action and witnessed many good people in Australia and Singapore laid off in the name of cost-cutting. It is mentioned in the article that for this 2014 round, people with even PBC 1 and 2 were fired, which would have been the top performing people on their teams. I worked as a project mana…

"Let's say that again: as of 2013, there were still hundreds of mission-critical IBM internal applications running on physical hardware until I was given the project to transition them to virtual servers."

Is this so shocking or even wrong? I would expect a company with the history and size of IBM to have tons of "old" hardware/processes. In fact it's that history, perceived wisdom and entrenchment that I would assume many in the enterprise world would would see as an asset for IBM. Am I the only one who doesn't think a business should jump on a new tech bandwagon at the expense of a solid and working business model? I'm not saying virtualization or cloud computing is a fad by any measure, but how does a company rationalize rebuilding old tech with the risk that it may be the wrong path/choice or jeopardize a working model?

I know little of IBM and cant say I'm part of the corporate/enterprise market but that fact that IBM has "old iron" in their portfolio seems to be less concerning for their customers and more of a perception issue among the media.

Re: IBM layoffs strike first in India; workers describe as 'slaughter' and 'massive'

#56

Post by iends »

Edmond wrote: post #27
negamax wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

According to article 'One analyst has estimated that IBM will cut 13,000 of its more than 434,000 workers'. Not sure how many (what percentage) is in India and how many are affected.

Most IBM employees are in India, over the years they've consistently trimmed their US workforce (got the treatment) to the point that only the research arm and a relatively small consulting staff and management remains US employees. I suspect that is how they've been able to impress financially given all the multimillion dollar troubled projects they've overseen. Should be interesting times to come. Apparently Watson…

This is not actually true. The unofficial IBM union (http://www.endicottalliance.org/) estimates there to be ~66,000 FTE in the USA.

Re: IBM layoffs strike first in India; workers describe as 'slaughter' and 'massive'

#57

Post by iends »

VLM wrote: post #21
negamax wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

According to article 'One analyst has estimated that IBM will cut 13,000 of its more than 434,000 workers'. Not sure how many (what percentage) is in India and how many are affected.

IBM is no longer a USA company and has not been for some time, logic would dictate that if they've only got ten thousand or so employees left in the USA, if they plan to downsize 13K, at least some citizens of India are going to have to go. They'll (probably) never get rid of the local USA sales force and some service techs, so by definition layoffs will now start to happen in India. GE is the same way, as are some o…

The unofficial IBM union (http://www.endicottalliance.org/) estimates there to be ~66,000 FTE in the USA.

Re: IBM layoffs strike first in India; workers describe as 'slaughter' and 'massive'

#59

Post by pekru »

josefresco wrote: post #55
PakG1 wrote: post #46

I have perhaps a unique perspective on this, as I was part of IBM in Asia and left in November 2013. I witnessed the 2013 layoff action and witnessed many good people in Australia and Singapore laid off in the name of cost-cutting. It is mentioned in the article that for this 2014 round, people with even PBC 1 and 2 were fired, which would have been the top performing people on their teams. I worked as a project mana…

"Let's say that again: as of 2013, there were still hundreds of mission-critical IBM internal applications running on physical hardware until I was given the project to transition them to virtual servers." Is this so shocking or even wrong ? I would expect a company with the history and size of IBM to have tons of "old" hardware/processes. In fact it's that history, perceived wisdom and entrenchment that I would assu…

Exactly.

Cloud is not the silver bullet. But at the same time, there is not much merit in choosing to be a luddite and not use the capabilities of cloud where there's a genuine need. I feel IBM, to an extent is guilty of not pursuing things on the cloud front and is now paying for it.

Re: IBM layoffs strike first in India; workers describe as 'slaughter' and 'massive'

#60

Post by negamax »

benjaminwootton wrote: post #42
negamax wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

According to article 'One analyst has estimated that IBM will cut 13,000 of its more than 434,000 workers'. Not sure how many (what percentage) is in India and how many are affected.

434 THOUSAND workers is incredible. What you could you possibly do with so many people!

Need a big army to enforce all the patents and extort money!
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