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Girls and Software

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Re: Girls and Software

#321

Post by VLM »

tomjakubowski wrote: post #189
superuser2 wrote: post #12

>Parents are warned to keep kids off the computer This point cannot be overstated. I'd never have been a hacker without vast quantities of unsupervised, unfiltered internet time around age 9-12. The largest enabling step for me was when I got my own laptop which I was free to break (software-wise) and free to take into my room so I could focus away from the distracting noises of the kitchen/living room. Much of even…

One summer in my childhood, my parents decided to severely restrict my siblings and I's access to the internet for unspecified reasons. We were each allowed 30 minutes use of the family computer and its Internet connection, which was "locked down" by passwords on the BIOS and Windows 98 screensaver. The laptop I shared with my brother and sister was still connected to our home LAN (through one of those crazy Intel An…

You owe your parents a beer (or whatever) as I can personally assure you its a heck of a hard job from the other side to implement that difficult enough that they learn something, but easy enough that they do not get discouraged. I started off simpler, like powering down infrastructure, moved on to cabling, then some basic trivial configuration debugging, you get the idea. Its hard work getting the balance just right so they learn something without giving up.

Re: Girls and Software

#322

Post by Consultant32452 »

DanielStraight wrote: post #306
krstck wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But with unlimited net access also comes extremely violent videos, social networks with all kinds of shady types hanging around etc... Those are all there in the real world, too. You can't protect kids from anything harmful or scary, nor should you. Stumbling across a porn or horror site is probably more traumatizing for the adult, anyway. It's like people have forgotten what it's like to be a kid! You've been told…

Really? Aside from rather extreme or contrived situations, the average person in the real world simply does not witness multiple graphic deaths or see thousands of women naked. Can we at least consider that there might be a psychological impact of the fact that in one afternoon you can see more horrors and more nudity than 99.999999% of the world would have seen in a lifetime two decades ago? That there is so incredi…

I think you have made a very strong argument that the internet content is not particularly damaging. As you assert you can see some pretty horrific stuff and just move right along. Of course seeing a picture on the internet is different than real life. Seeing that stuff in real life would be seriously damaging. Seeing it on the internet is "meh." I'd also like to add that I don't believe I've ever personally seen pictures of mass graves anywhere other than conventional media, television and news magazines. Yes, everything is on the internet, but if you're not looking for it you're not generally going to find it. And if you're looking for it, you're likely not going to be seriously harmed by seeing it.

Re: Girls and Software

#323

Post by epsylon »

timr wrote: post #54
bitwize wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For the longest time I harbored the biggest crush on a girl from my high school. The thing that made me fall in love with her (and it was love -- as much love as a 14-year-old could feel) wasn't that she was pretty or cute or popular -- though she was all these things. (Head cheerleader. Literally. Dated a football player and everything.) It was that I had the good fortune to peek over her shoulder at some BASIC code…

"My point here is that you become what you invest time in becoming. If you want to ascend to elite-level hackerdom, then you almost have to put things like attractiveness and popularity on the back burner." No, you really don't. You believe this because it's what you've seen around you, but that's a selection bias. Someone else on this thread pointed out that Von Neumann was an exceptionally stylish guy, but he's far…

> Von Neumann

You couldn't have picked a more outlying outlier. Von Neumann was one of the most brilliant minds of the century.

Re: Girls and Software

#324

Post by snarfy »

superuser2 wrote: post #12

>Parents are warned to keep kids off the computer This point cannot be overstated. I'd never have been a hacker without vast quantities of unsupervised, unfiltered internet time around age 9-12. The largest enabling step for me was when I got my own laptop which I was free to break (software-wise) and free to take into my room so I could focus away from the distracting noises of the kitchen/living room. Much of even…

You had unsupervised, unfiltered internet access when you were 9-12, yet did not hack into banks, steal credit card information, and other crimes? But you are a hacker!

Kids do not need to be warned to stay off the computer. They need to be taught right from wrong, to do the right thing, and to respect others.

Re: Girls and Software

#325

Post by Crake »

e12e wrote: post #296
Crake wrote: post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I could be wrong, but I think PTSD can be induced with images. You're wrong. I know tumblr likes to use the word "trigger" for just about everything, but real diagnosed PTSD is predicated on events significantly more traumatizing than seeing some photographs. There's nothing life-threatening about an image, no matter how disturbing.

> I know tumblr likes to use the word "trigger" for just about everything While I also find the use of "trigger warnings" rather strange, that usage has to do with triggering reactions that stem from actual PTSD, not that the images themselves can induce it. I know shooting victims can be troubled by fireworks, I don't doubt abuse victims can be troubled (or triggered) by images as well. I don't think that alone shou…

>not that the images themselves can induce it

And yet, that's exactly what people are doing here.

>but that doesn't mean we can't try to empathize with those that have experienced terrible things either

Please, continue to lecture someone with diagnosed PTSD about being nice to people with PTSD.

Re: Girls and Software

#326

Post by Crake »

marquis wrote: post #97
krstck wrote: post #51

Oooh, this was an icy stab right at the core. She's completely right: >Dump her in a situation that operates on different social scripts than she's accustomed to, full of people talking about a subject she doesn't yet understand. Then tell her the community is hostile toward women and therefore doesn't have enough of them, all while showing her off like a prize poodle so you can feel good about recruiting a females T…

That's the reason why classes for girls (not necessarily primarily but directed towards) work so well. Being in a room full of men with few or no women in ANY circumstance is awkward unless you are top of your game.

>Being in a room full of men with few or no women in ANY circumstance is awkward unless you are top of your game.

I've never really cared, whether I'm at the top or bottom of my game. Biological sex of the people around me is irrelevant--unless I'm going to a gay bar.

Re: Girls and Software

#327

Post by Crake »

tedks wrote: post #194
jseliger wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When I became a teenager, I got wind that it wasn't something "cool" and got spooked. For someone as insecure as I was, having a hobby that I couldn't really "explain" to normal people was embarrassing. When I was a teenager, coding or being technical in general wasn't cool either, and most of the people who were involved were or at least seemed insecure and embarrassed. Perhaps the climate in middle / high schools h…

When I was a teenager (which was not long ago), coding or being technical in general was entirely uncool, but widely acknowledged as powerful. People would come to me asking if I could "hack" various things ranging from friends Facebook accounts to banks. Teachers would ask you for help if things broke. At one point, the principal called me into his office to ask if I could help him trace a threat posted on the Inter…

>considered unfeminine

It's interesting to note, though, that it is only considered unfeminine by other women. Guys just think it's badass when they find a girl into the same stuff they're into.

Re: Girls and Software

#328

Post by Crake »

arrrg wrote: post #174
HedgeMage wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it makes me think: this might be a problem. Is it harder to be a hacker if you > also have an interest in social media and graphic design and popularity and > friendships? Are we defining "hacker" to include only people with bad social > skills and no interest outside of technology? I hope not. I never said any such thing. I didn't say "you are pretty, what are you doing here?". I said: >> you're not a programmer,…

Which feminist told you to dress or look a certain way? No doubt, there are feminists in the margins who think that way, but the vast majority of feminists I’ve ever met or talked to would be absolutely abhorred and disgusted by someone telling you how to dress or look. That’s certainly what I think. Gender policing is disgusting. I’ve real trouble integrating what you are saying with what I’ve heard feminists say ab…

>Which feminist told you to dress or look a certain way?

In my experience, feminists are more obsessed with making sure other women are dressed "correctly" than just about any other demographic outside of conservative christian republicans. Have you never read an article by a feminist about X or Y movie character is demeaning to women because she dressed too sexy, or wore something that the feminist herself would never wear?

Re: Girls and Software

#329

Post by Crake »

arrrg wrote: post #120

Nice, complete misunderstanding of feminism and what most people argue for. Nice attacking of straw men. Nice rant for the status quo. I’m sad now.

A woman said something you disagree with. Such a tragedy!!

Re: Girls and Software

#330

Post by judk »

hueving wrote: post #254
jiggy2011 wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hard to say for sure, when I was in school I felt like I was banking on technology becoming cooler over time which does seem to be the case. There's also less pressure on men to settle down early. A man can more easily think "fuck it, I won't start dating until I'm 25 by which time I'll be successful, drive a nice car and be an eligible bachelor". With the whole biological clock issue women are often hoping to be mar…

Is 25 really when most women are hoping to starting a family by?

Not just start a family, but, a man can spend 5 years dating, and at age 30 meet a 25 yr old to eventually have kids with. For women, youth is an advantage in dating. For men, the opposite, which both supports and demands career success.
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