How To Hire Outsourced Developers • Hacker News Board

Re: How To Hire Outsourced Developers

#61

Post by _delirium » Wed, Jan 15, 2014, 10:28 PM UTC

nnq wrote: post #51

Side question: don't other people also have serious issues with the practice of using tracking software that take screenshots, or even worse, webcam shots? When I was freelancing I quickly refused a lot of potentially well paying jobs because of the requirement to use such monitoring software (their loss imho...). I don't have a problem with video-chatting with an employer about anything, or even with a temporary scr…

It feels like it'd be hard to get work done that way too, unless you could somehow manage to forget that it was taking place. I can't really do much serious work when someone is standing behind me looking over my shoulder. If it's genuinely interactive or collaborative, sure: if they're looking over my shoulder because I'm showing them something, or they're helping me to do something, then sure. But standing behind me just "monitoring" me as I work solo? Sorta a creepy situation, and more than a bit distracting.

Re: How To Hire Outsourced Developers

#62

Post by caprad » Wed, Jan 15, 2014, 10:35 PM UTC

InformalRelief wrote: post #57

nnq wrote: post #51

Side question: don't other people also have serious issues with the practice of using tracking software that take screenshots, or even worse, webcam shots? When I was freelancing I quickly refused a lot of potentially well paying jobs because of the requirement to use such monitoring software (their loss imho...). I don't have a problem with video-chatting with an employer about anything, or even with a temporary scr…

During college I had a job in a coffee shop, and one day after a slow afternoon the bossman came in and later called me over to his computer, where he was reviewing his CCTV footage, and said "Look at how long it took you to make this cappucino, this is simply unacceptable!". I walked out.

Now imagine if your family relied on you having this job? How awful would that be.

Re: How To Hire Outsourced Developers

#63

Post by krapp » Wed, Jan 15, 2014, 10:38 PM UTC

nnq wrote: post #51

Side question: don't other people also have serious issues with the practice of using tracking software that take screenshots, or even worse, webcam shots? When I was freelancing I quickly refused a lot of potentially well paying jobs because of the requirement to use such monitoring software (their loss imho...). I don't have a problem with video-chatting with an employer about anything, or even with a temporary scr…

Yes, very much.

But at least with Elance and their tracker, any time not accounted for with a screenshot doesn't have to be paid.

Re: How To Hire Outsourced Developers

#64

Post by caprad » Wed, Jan 15, 2014, 10:41 PM UTC

This works if you already know how to code, and can come up with a quick 1 hour problem for them to solve. And it is a lot of work on your side as well. Filtering the list, checking the code, making sure they didn't cheat by checking github logs, pay someone else to review the candidates.

It would almost be quick to post the job online, break it up into stages, hire someone, check their progress, and move to the next person if their work is not satisfactory.

Re: How To Hire Outsourced Developers

#65

Post by [deleted] » Wed, Jan 15, 2014, 10:42 PM UTC

nnq wrote: post #51

Side question: don't other people also have serious issues with the practice of using tracking software that take screenshots, or even worse, webcam shots? When I was freelancing I quickly refused a lot of potentially well paying jobs because of the requirement to use such monitoring software (their loss imho...). I don't have a problem with video-chatting with an employer about anything, or even with a temporary scr…

[deleted]

Re: How To Hire Outsourced Developers

#66

Post by logn » Wed, Jan 15, 2014, 11:38 PM UTC

nnq wrote: post #51

Side question: don't other people also have serious issues with the practice of using tracking software that take screenshots, or even worse, webcam shots? When I was freelancing I quickly refused a lot of potentially well paying jobs because of the requirement to use such monitoring software (their loss imho...). I don't have a problem with video-chatting with an employer about anything, or even with a temporary scr…

I worked for a year with sporadic screen-shots and webcam shots on oDesk. I don't like webcam shots but I found screen-shots to improve my productivity actually.

Re: How To Hire Outsourced Developers

#67

Post by invalidOrTaken » Wed, Jan 15, 2014, 11:39 PM UTC

buzaga41 wrote: post #25

+1 for no ~foreign people are dumb~ undertones I've seen in other posts. I'm brasilian and I'm sure my skills could punch the skills of some developers elsewhere in the face, even if I make less. If you don't respect people who you work with, what are you? That's why, also, I'm at my last remote job, after this one goes, I'm getting back to local and corporate stuff.. Current one is great, but I've had enough bad exp…

It's not that foreign people are dumb, it's that foreign dumb people become developers. American dumb people do other stuff.

Re: How To Hire Outsourced Developers

#68

Post by ori_b » Thu, Jan 16, 2014, 12:35 AM UTC

invalidOrTaken wrote: post #67

buzaga41 wrote: post #25

+1 for no ~foreign people are dumb~ undertones I've seen in other posts. I'm brasilian and I'm sure my skills could punch the skills of some developers elsewhere in the face, even if I make less. If you don't respect people who you work with, what are you? That's why, also, I'm at my last remote job, after this one goes, I'm getting back to local and corporate stuff.. Current one is great, but I've had enough bad exp…

It's not that foreign people are dumb, it's that foreign dumb people become developers. American dumb people do other stuff.

It's not even that. It's that good developers don't need to bid on outsourcing sites.

Re: How To Hire Outsourced Developers

#69

Post by hcarvalhoalves » Thu, Jan 16, 2014, 12:59 AM UTC

Hijacking the thread...

I'm from Brazil and would like to get jobs elsewhere (the rates here are just sad). I've looked into oDesk and Elance, but the jobs / conditions suck. I've also tried getting in touch directly with companies when I see job postings, but it seems there's a barrier to hire from this side of the hemisphere.

Does anyone know any good site focused on remote job postings?

Re: How To Hire Outsourced Developers

#70

Post by memracom » Thu, Jan 16, 2014, 1:28 AM UTC

SheepSlapper wrote: post #9

Is anyone else tired of being assigned homework when applying for jobs? In both this and the author's previous article on hiring, he mentions giving people tasks to complete by a certain deadline as part of the hiring process. For someone that's just starting out as a programmer then maybe that's reasonable, but for those of us that've been in software for years, what's the point? You wouldn't ask a carpenter to make…

40 years of programming experience here. As far as I am concerned, if a potential employer wants to hire me for an hour or a day or a week to try me out before making a hiring decision, that is a fair exchange. In fact, where I live, an employer can fire you without notice and with no reason at all during the first 3 months of the job. That's the law, and this blog is really just about a more sensible way to pick people for the 3 month trial that are more likely to stay the course.

This is certainly preferably to wierd programming quizzes and coding on a whiteboard in front of silent people who give no clue as to what basis they are judging you. At least this guy gives you requirements and you know that you must provide a working application within an hour. Very clear targetted goal to aim for.