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Money can buy happiness

economist.com

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Re: Money can buy happiness

#91

Post by [deleted] »

rm999 wrote: post #26
leoedin wrote: post #3

The income scale is logarithmic, so the apparently linear lines that you see are actually curved. The returns in happiness per $ earned fall off significantly towards the top of the scale (which incidentally is capped at a fairly low $128,000). I don't really see how this new data contradicts the generally accepted view (mentioned in the article) that money increases happiness up to a point.

>I don't really see how this new data contradicts the generally accepted view (mentioned in the article) that money increases happiness up to a point. The article shows a logarithmic trend (i.e. doubling your income increases your happiness by a fixed amount), which is a straight line on the log plot. This insinuates ( if the trend continues, which is assumed from the results) that there is no point at which increase…

[deleted]

Re: Money can buy happiness

#94

Post by VLM »

billyjobob wrote: post #28

The participants were not asked how happy they were, they were asked where they stood on a 'satisfaction ladder' with the best life they could imagine at the top. Many people may be perfectly happy, but they know their position on the wealth scale and imagine that they would feel more satisfied at the top of that scale.

Another way to interpret it is the higher your income, the less you expect to be able to advance in the future on sort-linear-log scale. Or the poorer you are, you tend to feel poorer (than you actually are) on a sorta log scale.

There are no poor people in America, only temporarily inconvenienced millionaires.

Re: Money can buy happiness

#95

Post by PavlovsCat »

Am I wrong to dismiss just about anything that depends on asking people? I don't have good ideas on how to measure happiness, but even the worst of them seems better than asking and leaving it at that.

Re: Money can buy happiness

#96

Post by beachstartup »

marquis wrote: post #4

In regards to subjective happiness and income, I like to pose the question: Would you rather earn $80,000 and live in a neighbourhood of those earning $100,000, or would you rather earn $100,000 and live in a neighbourhood of those earning $80,000. Money and happiness is entirely subjective according to your environment.

this is a highly personal answer. it depends on a person's specific mechanisms of motivation and satisfaction. i realize this is a hypothetical "thought experiment", but you can see how this actually plays out in reality.

i've done both. i've lived in areas where i made significantly more than my neighbors (regular apartment complex in the middle of LA/hollywood), and now i live in a place where i make significantly less (i live in a modest condo next to giant $5-10M houses in santa monica and ultra-mansions a short distance further - think 'lower pac heights' in SF-speak)

it's obviously better living next to rich neighbors. everything in the neighborhood is much nicer, and i get to enjoy a lot of their wealth indirectly. for example, i live next to some of the best hospitals in the country. the public parks are ridiculously nice and all the streets are basically perfectly conditioned. seeing nice things/home/cars and rich people is also an aspirational trigger for me. also, for a very slightly higher prices on the things i actually buy, i get to enjoy better food and shopping.

in the other, poorer neighborhood where i made more money, everything was shitty (for US standards). the roads were in disrepair, there was crime, the food wasn't nearly as good, there was constant police activity, the roads would be blocked for public events, etc. seeing broke or down-and-out people everywhere bumemd it out. it was just an overall hassle.

if you took the median income from both areas, it probably wouldn't deviate by more than 50 grand. there are rich people in both areas. but one is significantly better than the other.

i really wouldn't understand the opposite point of view, that living next to poorer people is somehow better. perhaps if you lived in an imginary WORLD where you made significantly more than the rest of the people, but in the real world it's all about locales.

Re: Money can buy happiness

#97

Post by davidw »

vinceguidry wrote: post #89
auctiontheory wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

US? Mexico?! Ignoring the graph, you want to end up in a company with strong social services and wealth redistribution - Norway or somewhere similar. The US is not the best place to be poor. It also depends who "you" are. Are you black? A woman? Gay? Other countries may have a relative advantage over the US.

The US is still upwardly mobile. If you have any ambition at all, it's possible to rise. It's not easy , but it's far from impossible. http://www.nationalreview.com/article/367903/white-ghetto-ke... This article on the poorest county in the US is very interesting, while they're very poor, it's not like anyone's starving, the food stamp program seems to support them well enough.

Stats actually seem to show that mobility is lower in the US than in the nordic countries:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_mobility#Country_compari...

Of course the US is a very different place, too.

Re: Money can buy happiness

#98

Post by VLM »

Another peculiar interpretation of the same data: People segregate strongly by income, and you're happier if your neighbors are wealthy rather than poor. Not just crime but schools and parks and services.

Re: Money can buy happiness

#99

Post by oscargrouch »

nazgulnarsil wrote: post #69
oscargrouch wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are communities that doesnt even have a economy based on money, and are pretty happy.. there are indigenous people in reserves here and brazil and also some remote parts of africa that i know of.. (i imagine theres even more samples) If you start to look to them, they have a pretty smart way to achieve happyness without money.. they are very collective types in nature.. and not individualistic as we do.. the na…

yeah, the noble savages are very serene....until you notice the infectious disease and children and mothers constantly dying in childbirth.

just to make it clear: im not saying they live the perfect life.. but both types of civilizations have things to teach one another.. we have things to teach, but we also have things to learn.. things that we lost in the way..

What we constantly see, is the "white man" notion of superiority, and therefore that he has nothing to learn, from "primitives"..

But the irony is that they have a lot to teach us..

Our societies are very complex, and one of the reasons for that is the infinite chain of the desire and need.. need this, need that.. never satisfied, never happy..

Being poor its not the problem, the problem its us.. the way we think and reproduce our lives and destiny.. looking at them can teach us a lot about ourselves and where we are doing wrong

Re: Money can buy happiness

#100

Post by mertd »

Sakes wrote: post #86

Money can buy security and that security increases your happiness. Not having money can make you unhappy. Sustainable happiness is recognizing what is truly valuable in life and appreciating it. For me this is: 1) No debt 2) Full stomach/quenched thirst 3) A warm place to sleep 3) Meaningful intimate loving relationships 4) A sense that I am valuable (adding value to the world or some subset) 5) Freedom to indulge my…

That is pretty much Maslow's pyramid.
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