This article criticizes the time spent learning a new framework. However, it doesn't seem to note that creating a new bulletproof JavaScript framework will likely take a lot of more time.
Frameworkless JavaScript
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Re: Frameworkless JavaScript
#42While I agree with the salient point in the article, I disagree with the emphasis on the size of the script. If using a framework reduces headaches and saves developer time, it will be significantly less expensive to use the framework than to roll and host your own solution. ALSO, there exist cheap/free CDNs that host many of these libraries: backbone -- http://cdnjs.com/libraries/backbone.js/ rainbow -- http://cdnjs…
CDNs are not magic and there's a lot more than bandwidth to consider: you still have the overhead of doing DNS lookups, additional server connections and response latency before bandwidth enters the picture and the client overhead of decompressing, parsing and processing the response, where CSS will block rendering until it transfers and JavaScript will not only block rendering but also further loads until it finishes executing. Latency is almost always far more important to the user experience than the actual bandwidth and, particularly if you have many users on wireless networks, with blocking resources the concern isn't the average or best-case latency but the worst-case.
Libraries are still usually a reasonable trade for the reasons you mentioned but it puts a solid limit on your site's performance. If most of your users won't execute most of that code, it makes sense to reconsider – for example, if you could replace most of your jQuery usage with APIs like e.g. querySelector/querySelectorAll and your site only supports IE8+, it's quite reasonable to question whether you're getting enough benefit to be worth that download or whether there's a way to defer anything which isn't used all of the time. For example, much as I love LeafletJS, I'll toss in a rel=prefetch header for it but won't load the script until I need to display a map.
Re: Frameworkless JavaScript
#43While I agree with the salient point in the article, I disagree with the emphasis on the size of the script. If using a framework reduces headaches and saves developer time, it will be significantly less expensive to use the framework than to roll and host your own solution. ALSO, there exist cheap/free CDNs that host many of these libraries: backbone -- http://cdnjs.com/libraries/backbone.js/ rainbow -- http://cdnjs…
The cost of hosting might not matter, but increased page weight means increased bounce rate, especially among users with slower connections.
Re: Frameworkless JavaScript
#44No.
Re: Frameworkless JavaScript
#45Not using a JS Framework? Congratulations, you've just built your own ad hoc JS Framework. Suddenly, anyone who joins moot will have to invest tons of effort in your custom framework instead of being able to hit the ground running.
I don't use any 3rd party code for my current work as of now. So yes I have built my own "toolkit". Maybe a vector rendering library wil be required at some point, but I started off on bare bones to see how far you get.
It's not that I am generally against 3rd party code, JavaScript is just a bit special in that case. The quality of JavaScript libraries is just so outright bad that I don't have any use for most of them. I have a personal policy to only include code that satisfies my personal quality standards, if a codebase makes me cringe I will not use it but rather write my own.
Re: Frameworkless JavaScript
#46While I agree with the salient point in the article, I disagree with the emphasis on the size of the script. If using a framework reduces headaches and saves developer time, it will be significantly less expensive to use the framework than to roll and host your own solution. ALSO, there exist cheap/free CDNs that host many of these libraries: backbone -- http://cdnjs.com/libraries/backbone.js/ rainbow -- http://cdnjs…
Frameworks never reduce headaches or save developer time. They only push those things towards the end of the project when you can least afford it.
Re: Frameworkless JavaScript
#47Not using a JS Framework? Congratulations, you've just built your own ad hoc JS Framework. Suddenly, anyone who joins moot will have to invest tons of effort in your custom framework instead of being able to hit the ground running.
This sentiment, expressed collectively, commoditizes the entire profession. How can you expect to ask for raises if all devs are basically interchangeable? If we've eradicated all notions of design, and follow prescriptive rules of structuring and solving problems that anybody can Google and follow, then what avenues are left to express technical ability? What differentiates you?
I find the difference to be that each developer is now more productive and can add more function in less time.
The profession isn't commoditized, the lower end of the profession gets better, and those with the skills move up a notch and do more and more challenging things.
I used to build single-page javascript apps in pure javascript (pre-jQuery), and it was a pain. Once jQuery came along, things were easier. I actually don't think I'd have too much trouble going back and using just jQuery, but I don't think I'd be as productive as I am with backbone, angular or knockout.
Re: Frameworkless JavaScript
#48Earlier quoted context omitted.
Nope, it isn't. But clinging to frameworks in lieu of actual program design can hamper your ability to design something that doesn't fit neatly into a predefined box.
Of course. But no one seems to be suggesting otherwise, that I can see, and for the relatively common case in which one needs quickly to prototype and roll out something which does "fit neatly into a predefined box", a framework is often just the thing.
You touch on the one things that frameworks are actually good for: prototyping. Unfortunately they're never just used for that purpose. The prototype and all the framework cruft is then called "the product" and used as such.
And sure, then you have people who can come in and "hit the ground running" but they're little more than overpaid glue sticks. They don't understand true software engineering. They just know how to glue framework code together.
Re: Frameworkless JavaScript
#49I've just gone through a similar process of reviewing and discarding a number of JavaScript frameworks. I've settled on React, and I can't recommend it enough! React handles mostly the V in MVC, and does an admirable job of it. It even provides a cross-platform event abstraction, which would've saved the author some trouble. http://facebook.github.io/react/ http://facebook.github.io/react/blog/2013/06/05/why-react.ht…
I would recommend http://enyojs.com/
Re: Frameworkless JavaScript
#50Great post, needs to be said sometimes that custom code is always going to be smaller and do just enough. I'm also working on a real-time socket.io app and find that I can keep most of the data model logic on the server, and the front-end is focused on user interactions & rendering data. I do use Backbone but only the Views, but the overall architecture of the front end is clean, simple, and minimal.
You sir/madam, are doing it right.