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Why Tough Teachers Get Good Results

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21–30 of 74 posts

Re: Why Tough Teachers Get Good Results

#21

The implications in this article that strict = effective are flat-out stupid. A teacher does not have to be hardass to encourage children to have high expectations and to be OK with failure. I think a truly effective teacher, at all levels, will encourage curiosity and creativity in subject-matter. The best way to do this, in my view, is mutual respect. The teacher's idolised in this article seem to operate through f…

  mutual respect
Absolutely agree. Especially crucial in earlier years (with younger children), when it leads not only to a better learning environment but also helps to form a solid mindset.

Re: Why Tough Teachers Get Good Results

#22
post #12

Jaime Escalante http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jaime_Escalante "In 1987, 27 percent of all Mexican Americans who scored 3 or higher on the calculus AP exam were students at Garfield High" http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stand_and_Deliver

Wow. I guess I'll have to watch the movie.

Re: Why Tough Teachers Get Good Results

#23
Sure criticizing a below average performance tends to correlate with a better performance next time, and praise of above average performances tends to correlate with the next performance being worse. That's because the comparisons are to an average.

And he found that all of them "deliberately picked unsentimental coaches who would challenge them and drive them to higher levels of performance."

The article ignores selection bias from the get go. Participants in most high school activities [in the US] tend to be self-selected. In the string section of an orchestra, they are not only self selected but also thoroughly weeded out by the institution; there are no novices or dabblers.

Re: Why Tough Teachers Get Good Results

#24

Sure criticizing a below average performance tends to correlate with a better performance next time, and praise of above average performances tends to correlate with the next performance being worse. That's because the comparisons are to an average. And he found that all of them "deliberately picked unsentimental coaches who would challenge them and drive them to higher levels of performance." The article ignores sel…

>That's because the comparisons are to an average.

Also known as Regression toward the mean[1]. Talked about a bunch in Kahneman's Thinking, Fast and Slow.

[1]: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regression_toward_the_mean

Re: Why Tough Teachers Get Good Results

#25
post #12

Jaime Escalante http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jaime_Escalante "In 1987, 27 percent of all Mexican Americans who scored 3 or higher on the calculus AP exam were students at Garfield High" http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stand_and_Deliver

> http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jaime_Escalante

While he was rather strict/demanding, too, the article also hints to one of the more important causes of his success: "He rejected the common practice of ranking students from first to last and instead frequently told his students to press themselves as hard as possible in their assignments." In educational science the former is called social reference standard and the latter individual reference standard. While sadly the former is still in use more often, longitudinal studies have shown a strong positive effect on achievement for individual reference standards (I only have a German source right now: Rheinberg & Krug, 1999). The reason seems to be that students seem to attribute ratings with social reference to stable attributes like talent ("I'm just not good at math"), whereas individual benchmarks are more often interepreted as a result of (lack of) effort. Interestingly the socially disadvantaged have shown the strongest results with individual reference standards, just as in the case of Jaime Escalante.

Re: Why Tough Teachers Get Good Results

#26
It's impressive to me how she takes all this unrelated research and weaves it into "tough teachers" (tho that's possibly the fault of her editor).

It seems like the actually determining feature was that,

> "The core belief of these teachers was, 'Every student in my room is underperforming based on their potential, and it's my job to do something about it—and I can do something about it,'"

Punishing people for fucking up - traditionally what we think of as "tough", I think - is just punishing people for regressing to the mean: http://crookedtimber.org/2010/09/28/mean-and-regressive/

Re: Why Tough Teachers Get Good Results

#27
One of the most concise descriptions of good teachers I've seen actually came from pg in his "rarely asked questions" list. http://www.paulgraham.com/raq.html

(1) They had high standards. (2) They liked us. (3) They were interested in the subject.

I've been unable to express what makes a good teacher more concretely than that.

Re: Why Tough Teachers Get Good Results

#28
The article makes several points, each backed up by maybe one piece of research or anecdote vaguely related to the point.

It's sad how irresponsible journalists like this make a greater impact on public debate with flimsy articles like these.

Re: Why Tough Teachers Get Good Results

#29

The implications in this article that strict = effective are flat-out stupid. A teacher does not have to be hardass to encourage children to have high expectations and to be OK with failure. I think a truly effective teacher, at all levels, will encourage curiosity and creativity in subject-matter. The best way to do this, in my view, is mutual respect. The teacher's idolised in this article seem to operate through f…

> I think a truly effective teacher, at all levels, will encourage curiosity and creativity in subject-matter

Yes. The question is how do you encourage curiosity and creativity in kids? No, we are not talking about adults. I see this humble request as something similar to what JFK asked when he said America should send a man to the moon. If you have the opportunity, read about the changes all levels of education in the United States had to go through to meet the demands of that "simple" challenge. When you're done come back let's compare to now

> The teacher's idolised in this article seem to operate through fear, which eventually fades into a semblance of respect over time.

I'm Ghanaian. Educated in Ghana and lived all my life in Ghana. I've had several teachers like Mr. K along the way at almost all levels. I hated my primary and junior high school English Language teacher for "good" reasons. (Especially when he commanded, yes commanded, that English is the only language permitted to be spoken on campus.) I'd say worse things about him to my parents. But my dad liked him because his homework assignments kept me busy all the time. I knew I was a smart kid but the score I had for his tests said something else about me and I wasn't ready to accept that. No! So you know what, I worked harder and harder for what I knew was mine. Progress follows hardwork.

Now, every time I have the prized opportunity of shaking that man's hand I do so with a beaming face and a sort of pride that says to him: "I can't thank you enough for coming into my life." He's proud of his students and we're proud of him too. I speak and (perhaps) write good English because he piqued my interest and taught me to strive because I can always get better.

> None of that really goes beyond common sense

Beats my imagination that we always have to be reminded about commonsense. I was told economics is plain commonsense. But there's a Nobel prize for it, right? Maybe commonsense put itself too much in our face we linger for what's rare. And that "the solution is not the obvious solution" mantra (a.k.a bullshit) might not be true after all.

If you agree, can we just return to commonsense?

Re: Why Tough Teachers Get Good Results

#30
post #12

Jaime Escalante http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jaime_Escalante "In 1987, 27 percent of all Mexican Americans who scored 3 or higher on the calculus AP exam were students at Garfield High" http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stand_and_Deliver

They should make a follow-up movie about how the teachers' union drove Escalante out and destroyed the program:

"Over the next few years Escalante's calculus program continued to grow but not without its own price. Tensions that surfaced when his career began at Garfield escalated. In his final years at Garfield, Escalante received threats and hate mail from various individuals.[8] By 1990, he had lost the math department chairmanship. At this point Escalante's math enrichment program had grown to 400+ students. His class sizes had increased to over 50 students in some cases. This was far beyond the 35 student limit set by the teachers' union, which in turn increased criticism of Escalante's work. In 1991, the number of Garfield students taking advanced placement examinations in math and other subjects jumped to 570. That same year, citing faculty politics and petty jealousies,[citation needed] Escalante and Jiménez left Garfield. Escalante found new employment at Hiram W. Johnson High School in Sacramento, California. At the height of Escalante's influence, Garfield graduates were entering the University of Southern California in such great numbers that they outnumbered all the other high schools in the working-class East Los Angeles region combined.[9] Even students who failed the AP went on to become star students at California State-Los Angeles in large numbers.[8]

Angelo Villavicencio took the reins of the program after their departure and taught the remaining 107 A.P. students in two classes for the next year. 67 of Villavicencio's students went on to take the A.P. exam and 47 passed. Villavicencio's request for a third class due to class size was denied and the following spring he followed Escalante and quit Garfield. The math program's decline at Garfield became apparent following the departure of Escalante and other teachers associated with its inception and development. In just a few years, the number of A.P. calculus students at Garfield who passed their exams dropped by more than 80 percent. In 1996, Villavicencio contacted Garfield's new principal, Tony Garcia, and offered to come back to help revive the dying calculus program. His offer was rejected.[8]"

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