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Ask HN: How to fire your co-founder?

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Re: Ask HN: How to fire your co-founder?

#71

Post by damm »

mesogamer wrote: post #23
badclient wrote: post #4

If I talk with my boards on his misbehaviour it will get them stressed and stop believing on the company Sorry dude, looks like that is precisely what you are going to have to do. Don't worry about the board stressing; they can handle it. That's their job. Focus on YOUR job: the success of the company. The board will stop believing you when you prolong this longer than you should have, actually making the situation m…

Thanks for the advice. I might go with this one after holiday ends. The only problem I see here is that he has more rapport with them (since I'm more product oriented and he's money oriented). It's going to get real messy, especially since he holds all money, bank, passwords info (now I understand why he wanted to take control of those stuff in the beginning). Firing him will be so messy, and the 3 employees we have…

I imagine this will get ugly if you just change the passwords and revoke his access. He owns a decent share of the company so my suggestion would be if you want this company. Buy his share and give him the money.

During this period of time you can hire a team (or someone) to secure your companies credentials. Hiring a team to review your assets both physical and virtual; code base and otherwise would be wise.

Re: Ask HN: How to fire your co-founder?

#72

Post by [deleted] »

pnut wrote: post #70
logicallee wrote: post #67

My take here differs a bit from that of the rest of the thread. How about this OP - who are you to fire your coworker after he got a cosy relationship with a board? This is literally no better than firing an 'idea man' after they did nothing, except just bring an idea, set up a company around it, and code the first version. Who are you to do that? If you were good enough to found and run a company by yourself, includ…

I was about to write something similar to this. So someone with 40% of the company thinks the other guy with equivalent ownership isn't worth his share? What if that guy thinks the same thing about you? The other guy apparently has employee loyalty, funding, and administrative controls on his side... I am not at all convinced that the OP deserves sympathy for wanting to screw his business partner, and publicly solici…

[deleted]

Re: Ask HN: How to fire your co-founder?

#73

Post by jcc80 »

late2part wrote: post #64

Let's see. He's the expert. He controls the money. He has the rapport with the board. Maybe he helped get a lot of the funding? Sounds like he's pulled a lot of weight so far. Maybe he's not pulling the weight, but like a movie the other day, a Washing Machine works hard, so what. Think through if he's benefitting the company in his total contribution. If you want more from him, ask. If he won't do it, explain it's u…

"Those facts will be interpreted through the lens of relationships."

This is the key point for everyone advising him to go to the board or quit and start anew with the employees. It's unlikely the board meeting will go well unless the other cofounder has done something seriously wrong. Trying to work out goals with him, as suggested, has a better chance of being productive compared to asking him to reduce his equity.

Re: Ask HN: How to fire your co-founder?

#74

Post by blazespin »

mesogamer wrote: post #23
badclient wrote: post #4

If I talk with my boards on his misbehaviour it will get them stressed and stop believing on the company Sorry dude, looks like that is precisely what you are going to have to do. Don't worry about the board stressing; they can handle it. That's their job. Focus on YOUR job: the success of the company. The board will stop believing you when you prolong this longer than you should have, actually making the situation m…

Thanks for the advice. I might go with this one after holiday ends. The only problem I see here is that he has more rapport with them (since I'm more product oriented and he's money oriented). It's going to get real messy, especially since he holds all money, bank, passwords info (now I understand why he wanted to take control of those stuff in the beginning). Firing him will be so messy, and the 3 employees we have…

"the 3 employees we have today respect him a lot"

This is a big red flag. Who hired those people? Why did you agree to hire them if you don't respect their judgement? Or is your co-founder also doing all the hiring as well as taking care of everything else?

Starting to sound like you should be asking yourself what you contribute.

Re: Ask HN: How to fire your co-founder?

#75

Post by argonaut »

cma wrote: post #43
greghinch wrote: post #9

This is why you have a board. And hopefully some decent legal documentation in place. Talk to them, lay out facts and the action you want to take, and just follow the documented process for things like board votes and such (again I hope you have legal docs in place, otherwise be prepared to get a lawyer and slog it out…). Sounds like you think the success of your company might depend on you getting rid of him, so jus…

Majority shareholders can't just vote to take away equity from minority holders. There are laws about minority shareholder rights. The OP better have some really specific agreements in place.

My impression is that in California boards have large latitude to extremely dilute minority holders.

Re: Ask HN: How to fire your co-founder?

#76

Post by almosnow »

Just tell him, plain and square:

"When we started on this endeavour I was expecting you to behave/provide/take care of X and you are not doing those things that we agreed on (or the results you are delivering are WAY OFF the expectations that the company had on you). You cannot be part of this if you are not helping it getting better. I'm sorry but I don't want to continue with our business relationship."

Be honest (with him and with yourself), you DON'T WANT HIM and there's nothing wrong with it. The more transparent you are here, the better you'll come out of 'the negotiation'.

The negotiation: Wether you want it or not, he owns some part of the company, even if he had just been doing jack shit the fact that you invited him to your endeavour and you are still referring him as a co-founder means that he's ethically entitled to 'something'. Now, it's up to you to decide what is that 'something' that he deserves'; again, just be honest and talk about what would be fair for him to take.

Be honest! That's the only rule here and if he co-founded this thing with you (even though you knew he wasn't worth it, or didn't knew at all) chances are that you may be real-life pals; if that's the case, just solve it like pals, after all it's always better to have a friend than a dollar.

Re: Ask HN: How to fire your co-founder?

#77

Post by owenmarshall »

raverbashing wrote: post #59
bushido wrote: post #41

I apologize in advance, but since nobody else seems to have taken the initiative I will opt for being the ass_ole in this situation. Before you go to the board (you ethically should) let ascertain a few things. Are you sure he's an overrate person or is it just that you don't see the value in his input? Some where in the thread you mentioned: > It's going to get real messy, especially since he holds all money, bank,…

This is important If you want to (you should and must) get to the board and present your concerns, they are going to need those questions answered It will only help your case If your cofounder is as bad as I'm imagining, you should do your homework: get emails, recordings, etc which is strongly hinted by his threat (make sure you get him on that, record with your cell phone - hidden - or something) But there's also a…

>make sure you get him on that, record with your cell phone - hidden - or something

Be incredibly careful: this could be a violation of state privacy/wiretapping laws.

Re: Ask HN: How to fire your co-founder?

#78

Post by skoutlabs »

Having gone through this, I would immediately read through your operating agreement, and any other operating documents. I went through same process, having numerous well documented discussions with cofounder.

If you wait to long, and your cofounder feels a threat, they may beat you to the punch.

After doing more than a million in revenue in our first 3 quarters and hiring a team of 15+, I was fired. A clause in our operating agreement allowed for this to happen, even with equal equity.

I encourage you to act quickly and very accurately in order to alleviate any risk of your partner taking action against you.

Good luck. I sincerely wish you the best. As messy as it gets, stay honest, stick to the points, and don't overreact in your defense. It will all work out as long as you diligently work to resolve the issue.

Re: Ask HN: How to fire your co-founder?

#79

Post by iquitmyphd »

(Sort of disclaimer, this may or may not be terrible advice from a legal perspective, IANAL)

So first off all, get someone to talk this through. Ideally someone who can give you an honest opinion, but any second opinion is better than none.

And second, after you decided to use the nuclear option, shelf it as a plan B. The nice thing is, almost everything is better than that. So you can plan with a lot more freedom, and you can play with a lot of risk. If it does not work out, then you just push the button and go nuclear. In your case, when you decided that there is only one of you left when the dust has settled, then you don't need to worry how you can work together in the future. One way to exploit this, you can be brutally honest. Perhaps you find a common basis again, or you go to your board.

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