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How Google keeps employees by treating them like kids (2006)

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Re: How Google keeps employees by treating them like kids (2006)

#31

Post by com2kid »

tikhonj wrote: post #27
derwiki wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm surprised at how polarizing no offices vs open offices is. My first job at IBM, I had an office with two co-workers. They were great, but on days they were out it was sooo isolating. When I quit and took a job at a start up in SF with an open office plan, I loved it immediately. I could look across the room and see if the systems guy was there or getting coffee, instead of pinging into the Sametime void. So, I'm…

This is something I've found very weird: there's a sharp difference between the opinions of people I know in person and people online. HN commenters love to hate open office plans. It's one of the few topics on which they agree with /r/programming! And yet everywhere I've spent time has been in favor of open offices. This includes a few startups, sure, but also an enterprise software company (Guidewire), an academic…

I wonder how many of those people ever had their own office. If you don't know any better, what you have may seem pretty good.

Both have their advantages and disadvantages. For some types of problem solving, a closed space to think for an extended period of time is really useful.

Re: How Google keeps employees by treating them like kids (2006)

#32

Post by pvdm »

charleslmunger wrote: post #22

I don't think this is really accurate. It's not about treating people like kids, it's about rejecting the attitude found at dilbert-style corporations. The T-Rex skeleton and the shark fins are there because they're cool. Google has monorail cars as meeting rooms in the Sydney office [1] - because an engineer requested it. It shows that management listens to employees. It gives people the confidence to propose somewh…

The article is from 2006. Things evolve.

Re: How Google keeps employees by treating them like kids (2006)

#35

Post by nilkn »

tikhonj wrote: post #27
derwiki wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm surprised at how polarizing no offices vs open offices is. My first job at IBM, I had an office with two co-workers. They were great, but on days they were out it was sooo isolating. When I quit and took a job at a start up in SF with an open office plan, I loved it immediately. I could look across the room and see if the systems guy was there or getting coffee, instead of pinging into the Sametime void. So, I'm…

This is something I've found very weird: there's a sharp difference between the opinions of people I know in person and people online. HN commenters love to hate open office plans. It's one of the few topics on which they agree with /r/programming! And yet everywhere I've spent time has been in favor of open offices. This includes a few startups, sure, but also an enterprise software company (Guidewire), an academic…

While my experience is similar, I can also state that none of my coworkers who have had private offices have ever mentioned or even implied in any way that they'd prefer a desk in an open space.

Re: How Google keeps employees by treating them like kids (2006)

#36

Post by declan »

ex-googler1 wrote: post #8
jacob019 wrote: post #4

read this before noticing it was written in 2006 by Aaron Schwartz. That certainly colors the perspective. I wonder how much has changed.

not much. i quit a few months ago and so happy to be out of that insane place. they compare your work against your coworkers, so its constant competition, even if you meet your "goals". they also have zero work/life balance. all that free food and google shuttles wear off after a couple of months. then their non-stop work life settles in and you realize you made a horrible decision by accepting the job offer. the onl…

"the only bright side is you get stock options"

Didn't Google stop giving out stock options something like five years ago? Sounds like "ex-googler1", an account created an hour ago, isn't actually one.

Re: How Google keeps employees by treating them like kids (2006)

#37

Post by auctiontheory »

blazespin wrote: post #26

Simply not true in 2013. They are aggressively hiring engineers of all sorts. College degrees are less relevant. Google, of all companies, have developed some of the finest talent recognition software in the valley.

Google, of all companies, have developed some of the finest talent recognition software in the valley.

Maybe they have, but we won't know without hard evidence. Your assertion doesn't make it so.

I like Google, I've eaten in their cafeterias (many friends work there), and I use several of their products.

And ... I'm aware that essentially all of their revenue comes from AdWords and AdSense. Everything else is subsidized by those two products. No other major Google product has had to compete in the marketplace on its own merits. So, objectively, it's hard to measure how talented their people are. (You're not going to convince me that Google has the world's most talented UI designers.)

Re: How Google keeps employees by treating them like kids (2006)

#38

Post by presorted »

luu wrote: post #15

Funny, my experience is the opposite on literally every concrete assertion about people and motivations. Looking at my team, and the broader team under my director, only one was hired "straight out of college". Well, if you consider fresh PhDs to be "straight out of college", there are a few, but I doubt Aaron meant folks approaching 30 with kids on the horizon when he was talking about people just out of college. Pe…

Being infantile means that you are an adult that behaves regressively. People with kids, and in their mid-thirties, can be infantile. I think that Aaron knew what he was saying. The problem is how do you judge whether someone is infantile, because you must either judge relative to yourself, or relative to a role model. If we are to believe Aaron, then we must believe that he could distinguish between a mature adult and regressive behavior --- and if we are to believe you, then we must believe the same of you. And if I'm to play the judge, then I need to know this myself, and I've found it to be a complex topic, and since it involves growth, it is a lifelong pursuit. Perhaps the one objective statement we can make is that we eventually must become independent of our parents and the safety of the parental home.

Re: How Google keeps employees by treating them like kids (2006)

#39

Post by robyates »

derwiki wrote: post #11
pcvarmint wrote: post #5

I thought it looked creepy, like an adult daycare center. I was approached twice and interviewed twice by Google but I don't think I'd fit that culture. No offices -- just open spaces. A meritocracy where you are evaluated by your peers generally, rather than by a boss or customer for your merits in a particular job. Where you don't even know what you will be working on until you're hired, as if that gives you a choi…

I'm surprised at how polarizing no offices vs open offices is. My first job at IBM, I had an office with two co-workers. They were great, but on days they were out it was sooo isolating. When I quit and took a job at a start up in SF with an open office plan, I loved it immediately. I could look across the room and see if the systems guy was there or getting coffee, instead of pinging into the Sametime void. So, I'm…

I enjoy the open floor plan as well. The ease in which I can have conversations with my manager (assuming they are sitting near to me) is probably the biggest benefit. I feel this makes me more productive since more impromptu conversations can take place. Being able to listen in on any random coworker conversations and nerf gun battles is nice as well. However, on the few occasions when private space in necessary, then an office would be preferred. Of course, many others prefer individual offices to an open floor plan. Similar to living in a city or the suburbs (SF vs. Silicon Valley here in the Bay area), it is a personal preference that never ceases to divide people.

Re: How Google keeps employees by treating them like kids (2006)

#40

Post by auctiontheory »

amaks wrote: post #16
ex-googler1 wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

not much. i quit a few months ago and so happy to be out of that insane place. they compare your work against your coworkers, so its constant competition, even if you meet your "goals". they also have zero work/life balance. all that free food and google shuttles wear off after a couple of months. then their non-stop work life settles in and you realize you made a horrible decision by accepting the job offer. the onl…

AFAIK, Google doesn't have stock options. I don't think you worked for Google.

I think it's pretty clear he meant RSUs. "Stock option" is still the colloquial term.
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