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Governments admit to faking terrorism: a list

ritholtz.com

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Re: Governments admit to faking terrorism: a list

#111

Post by panacea »

braincellbattle wrote: post #106
Mikeb85 wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In Canada we don't do either in public schools. Singing the national anthem is pretty much reserved just for Remembrance Day, maybe with a little bit of practice for a few days beforehand to avoid embarrassment at not knowing the lyrics. Certainly no prayers are ever said at school.

I'm Canadian and not that old (30's), and I was required to both sing the national anthem and recite The Lord's Prayer daily in grade school. Granted it might have been an exception as it was a small town.

Australian (30's). We recited The Lord's Prayer daily in public primary school (the Government run one) and regularly sang the national anthem.

Re: Governments admit to faking terrorism: a list

#112

Post by joelrunyon »

> People are slowly waking up to this whole con job by governments who want to justify war.

More people are talking about the phrase “false flag” than ever before.

Here's an interesting google trends graph of the phrase over time - http://www.google.com/trends/explore#q=false%20flag

Re: Governments admit to faking terrorism: a list

#113

Post by coldtea »

leot wrote: post #50
coldtea wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Of course, the more liberal/democratic the country, and the more recent, the more weak/stetched the case is. Not really, quite the opposite. The most "liberal" countries are the worst perpetrators of such things, if we're talking about Western democracies. They usually do it outside their territorry to assert influence on countries and place allies in power, grab resources, prevent unfavorable regime change etc. (N…

What? This is like saying that peaceniks are, in reality, the most violent of all. That after leaving Love-All-Equal Unitarian Church, the church-goers spend time studying the strategies of Hermann Goering. That's utter hogwash. For some reason, neither Scandinavia, nor Canada, nor Switzerland appear on the list as perpetrators. And when Italy does, it's when the country is run by a decidedly illiberal corporatist/fa…

>What? This is like saying that peaceniks are, in reality, the most violent of all. That after leaving Love-All-Equal Unitarian Church, the church-goers spend time studying the strategies of Hermann Goering. That's utter hogwash.

Study the history of colonialism. BILLIONS of people enslaved, suffered, killed, mamed, had their resources and country stolen and such. All by "civilized western societies" such as England, France, Belgium, Holland, et co. And then post-colonialism, where US plays a major role.

>For some reason, neither Scandinavia, nor Canada, nor Switzerland appear on the list as perpetrators.

Yes, and the reason is they didn't do much if anything bad in that regard.

Then again, I didn't say that ALL western democracies did such things.

I also didn't say that this behavior is inherent to being a democracy.

I only said that the worst offenders in such matters have historically been (and continue to be) western democracies.

Here's just an example, the tip of the iceberg, of what they still continue to do:

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/africa/inside-france...

Re: Governments admit to faking terrorism: a list

#114

Post by pizza234 »

mtdewcmu wrote: post #107
AnthonyMouse wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The false-flags that involved the US are the exceptions that prove the rule. Are they? They are certainly rare, but so are actual terrorists attacks in the United States. If you choose at random an attack on the US outside of a combat zone within our lifetimes, you have a nontrivial probability that it was an admitted false flag operation. And that's just counting the ones they've admitted. This isn't to say that w…

The distinctive thing about hardcore conspiracy theorists is that they don't base their ideas on reality (reality as perceived by non-conspiracy theorists). They are not truly skeptics, because their skepticism is selectively applied. They are typically willing to believe anything they hear, just so long as it comes from another conspiracy theorist who shares the belief that everything the government says is a lie. S…

There's no such thing as "reality".

Until a short time ago, the idea that some state would extensively spy into his and other countries people's communications would have been labelled as a conspiracy theory.

Now that the documents have uncovered what's going on, it's not a conspiracy theory anymore.

I understand that some people have ideas based on extremely unlikely scenario. But nonetheless, the reality you write about is based on what's available.

How do you know what's not available?

The article is confusing, but it has a point, and it's that the governments of the countries listed (there is clear winner in numbers...) have essentially sold their morale for political purposes, regardless of it having the form of faking of terrorism, or masking war crimes. I think that some of them arrived to the point of thinking that sacrificing a few (dozens? hundreds? thousands?) of their citizen for such purposes, would be reasonable.

Re: Governments admit to faking terrorism: a list

#116

Post by codfrantic »

moocowduckquack wrote: post #87
baddox wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It would take extensive use of brainwashing and belief in fairy tales about an enlightened government, a city on hill exceptional-ism or what-have-you to think these don't happen. And the only way a government could pull that off would be to do something drastic, like if it forced all citizens to sit listening to government employees deliver government curricula for 8 hours a day for twelve years during some of the…

In schools, some countries tell the kids to do morning prayer, and some tell them to sing the national anthem. Some countries tell them to do both. I can't think of that many countries where they are not normally prompted to do either one or the other.

Netherlands here, no such thing in public schools, friends of mine who went to Catholic schools do mention morning prayers, I'm still thankful my parents sent me to a public school!

Re: Governments admit to faking terrorism: a list

#117

Post by NIL8 »

jackpirate wrote: post #34
rdtsc wrote: post #19

This is a tried and true tactic. It would take extensive use of brainwashing and belief in fairy tales about an enlightened government, a city on hill exceptional-ism or what-have-you to think these don't happen. However, this level of brainwashing is achieved in US quite often. It is a lot worse vis-a-vis the rhetoric of independence, free thinking, individualism. But that in an of itself (this belief that we are no…

they realize what they have to do in their jobs contradicts the high idealized patriotic beliefs of what this country is about This is extremely uncommon. For example, I used to be a submarine officer in the Navy, and I left as a conscientious objector because of this realization. In an average year, less than 100 active duty service members will apply for conscientious objector status (there are over 1 million activ…

The NSA's morale is low because shit rolls downhill.

The pressure is increased while blame flows down The Hill through every office and cubicle. New procedures are set in place so that supervisors can tell their supervisors what steps they've taken to ensure there won't be another Snowden. Peons scramble to adopt these new procedures all while under closer scrutiny from everyone around them. Everyone, including the janitors, are pressed to find "traitors" in their ranks. All of this while harvesting/analyzing new data and shredding/deleting evidence. I'm guessing that $100,000+ salary is fast losing it's allure.

Re: Governments admit to faking terrorism: a list

#119

Post by goblin89 »

capex wrote: post #44
recuter wrote: post #30

It is actually incredibly easy to see how smart people tasked with solving complicated societal problems arrive at false flag operations as a viable solution: Imagine you have a credible imminent threat to your society posted by a danger to which the society is not familiar enough with to fully grasp and take seriously. Do you wait for the threat to play out and take your chances with the society sufficiently changin…

> "Innocent people will die either way." This is no gray area.

In above hypothetical situation, prior “galvanization” causes controllable damage. If you don't do this, and the worst happens, does this mean that many people are now dead due to your negligence? After all, the information you had did indicate that chances of such a disaster would drop dramatically if you fake an attack in time.

This might be very painful to realize, I think.

Re: Governments admit to faking terrorism: a list

#120

Post by radio4fan »

eoin_murphy wrote: post #97
moocowduckquack wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In schools, some countries tell the kids to do morning prayer, and some tell them to sing the national anthem. Some countries tell them to do both. I can't think of that many countries where they are not normally prompted to do either one or the other.

There are many countries which prompt for neither prayer nor patriotism. Ireland certainly does not and I don't think the UK does either (certain very religious schools of course may differ).

Bizarrely, in the UK there is a law which mandates daily religious worship in all state-maintained schools:

http://webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/20130401151655/htt...

"Since the 1944 Education Act, re-enacted in all subsequent Education Acts, there has been a statutory requirement that all maintained schools must provide a daily act of collective worship for all registered pupils, unless they have been withdrawn by their parents. The Education Act 1988 removed the requirement for this to take place at the start of the school day. Collective Worship can now take place any time of the school day."

In practice, the law is widely ignored.

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