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NSA infected 50,000 computer networks with malicious software

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Re: NSA infected 50,000 computer networks with malicious software

#11
post #3

We don't need the Snowden disclosures to know this; it has for 15 years been the worst kept secret in computer security. People from the various groups in NSA that do this work talk about having done it on Twitter. Some of the smartest people in vulnerability research came from stints in NSA. Be outraged that we're spying on your country if that makes you feel better, I guess. I'd rather nobody spied on each other ei…

Has there ever been an NSA thread where you didn't take the opportunity to tell us why whatever the NSA has been doing is completely normal and expected?

Re: NSA infected 50,000 computer networks with malicious software

#12
post #3

We don't need the Snowden disclosures to know this; it has for 15 years been the worst kept secret in computer security. People from the various groups in NSA that do this work talk about having done it on Twitter. Some of the smartest people in vulnerability research came from stints in NSA. Be outraged that we're spying on your country if that makes you feel better, I guess. I'd rather nobody spied on each other ei…

Has there ever been an NSA thread where you didn't take the opportunity to tell us why whatever the NSA has been doing is completely normal and expected?

Yes. For instance, I was not a believer in the NSA curve backdoors.

Unfortunately for whatever innuendo you're trying to evoke here, I'm on pretty firm ground when I say that NSA sponsoring computer hacking is normal and expected. I say that because you can find it on people's fucking resumes.

Re: NSA infected 50,000 computer networks with malicious software

#13
post #6
post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess that makes it ok then.

Sovereign countries interact in the state of nature. Your country has a problem with the NSA? Pick up a SAT solver and build yourself some ROP shellcode and hit us back. Oh wait: your country's already doing that . Do I like it? No. We don't work with the USG, and that's one of many reasons why.

I’m not sure what intrusions you’re referring to. Would you care to elaborate?

Re: NSA infected 50,000 computer networks with malicious software

#15
post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Has there ever been an NSA thread where you didn't take the opportunity to tell us why whatever the NSA has been doing is completely normal and expected?

Yes. For instance, I was not a believer in the NSA curve backdoors. Unfortunately for whatever innuendo you're trying to evoke here, I'm on pretty firm ground when I say that NSA sponsoring computer hacking is normal and expected. I say that because you can find it on people's fucking resumes.

[deleted]

Re: NSA infected 50,000 computer networks with malicious software

#17

Don't people usually get to spend decades in prison for that? Shouldn't justice be the same for the NSA as it was for Kevin Mitnick?

As much as I really don't like what the NSA is doing, this argument isn't valid. Law enforcement privileges cannot be directly compared to those of regular citizens. If you want to argue they've abused their privileges... then I'm with you 1,337%

Re: NSA infected 50,000 computer networks with malicious software

#18
post #3

We don't need the Snowden disclosures to know this; it has for 15 years been the worst kept secret in computer security. People from the various groups in NSA that do this work talk about having done it on Twitter. Some of the smartest people in vulnerability research came from stints in NSA. Be outraged that we're spying on your country if that makes you feel better, I guess. I'd rather nobody spied on each other ei…

>But it is intellectually dishonest to pretend that people are just now discovering that NSA was breaking into computers around the world. That is literally the charter of the NSA. It's why they exist at all.

You're presenting a red herring here, tptacek. Any third grader who played played Splinter Cell would say, "No duh!" But the news isn't that the NSA is breaking into computers. The news is the scope of the intrusions (installing malware on 50k computers), and of the motivations for the behavior. We've been told it's to protect us from the extremist muslims attempting to establish a caliphate here in America [1]. That was a lie. 50k computers with US-planted malware on them is not a defensive maneuver. It's an offensive one. It's not about protecting America. It's about global information dominance.

Now, whether we want that or not is a different question; there are advantages and disadvantages to the issue depending to a large degree on whether or not you believe in American exceptionalism. But this is about an executive power grab, not about "spies spy, let's all go home now," and you're deluding yourself if you believe otherwise.

[1] http://www.nsa.gov/public_info/_files/speeches_testimonies/T...

Re: NSA infected 50,000 computer networks with malicious software

#19
post #18
post #3

We don't need the Snowden disclosures to know this; it has for 15 years been the worst kept secret in computer security. People from the various groups in NSA that do this work talk about having done it on Twitter. Some of the smartest people in vulnerability research came from stints in NSA. Be outraged that we're spying on your country if that makes you feel better, I guess. I'd rather nobody spied on each other ei…

>But it is intellectually dishonest to pretend that people are just now discovering that NSA was breaking into computers around the world. That is literally the charter of the NSA. It's why they exist at all. You're presenting a red herring here, tptacek. Any third grader who played played Splinter Cell would say, "No duh!" But the news isn't that the NSA is breaking into computers. The news is the scope of the intru…

The NSA was breaking into huge numbers of computers long before we were worried about a "caliphate", and the fact that they were doing it was showing up on people's resumes before 9/11 as well.

And this isn't about "American Exceptionalism". China didn't hack Google because they were upset about NSA hacking; they did it because Google had information they wanted, so they took it.

Re: NSA infected 50,000 computer networks with malicious software

#20
post #10
post #4

What would happen if NSA mistakenly targets a nuclear reactor, and a bug in the malicious software caused a meltdown. Is that a declaration of war, similar to a US launching a nuke? Would US be liable, and under what jurisdiction? Could the US President be put under Interpool arrest warrant, charged as an terrorist? Sabotage, especially when the target can not be fully verified, is a dangerous game. IP addresses are…

Yes, that seems pretty simple: if NSA hacking caused a nuclear disaster, that would be an act of war. And?

No, that would not simply be an act of war. If that was the case, it would actually be a war crime, according to the international humanitarian law.
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