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Ubuntu 13.10 (Saucy Salamander)

releases.ubuntu.com

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Re: Ubuntu 13.10 (Saucy Salamander)

#171
post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have always found that continous upgrade eventually break the system. A clean install should be the recommended choice.

I have been updating my Lenovo laptop every 6 months since 7.03 and it's still going fine.

And I since 9.10. Sure, I've had my problems with it due to certain customisations applied, but to the best of my knowledge nothing that I haven't brought on myself, and I've been able to sort it out each time without significant trouble.

Re: Ubuntu 13.10 (Saucy Salamander)

#172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wait, Netflix works on Linux? When did this happen?

Yep, at least on Ubuntu 12.04: http://lifehacker.com/5963726/netflix-finally-comes-to-ubunt...

To add a little more info to that article ("The app basically packages WINE and Netflix into a simple little desktop app"), the package basically shows you the Netflix site in a Firefox frame with the silverlight plugin installed.

Re: Ubuntu 13.10 (Saucy Salamander)

#173
post #124

The main feature I'm looking forward to is zswap in kernel 3.11 [1]. Basically instead of swapping, the kernel will first compress infrequently used pages in RAM, which is orders of magnitude faster than swapping to disk. The practical effect of this is basically the same as a free RAM upgrade! [1] https://lwn.net/Articles/537422/

Basically, we'll soon be able to download more RAM!

Re: Ubuntu 13.10 (Saucy Salamander)

#174
post #141
post #124

The main feature I'm looking forward to is zswap in kernel 3.11 [1]. Basically instead of swapping, the kernel will first compress infrequently used pages in RAM, which is orders of magnitude faster than swapping to disk. The practical effect of this is basically the same as a free RAM upgrade! [1] https://lwn.net/Articles/537422/

You mean zram, right? I've been using that for months on Gentoo, it gave me about 10% speedup. Maybe you already have it available too, try: $ sudo modprobe zram

No, I don't mean zram. See ava1ar's answer to this stackoverflow question: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/18437205/difference-betwe...

The big differences are (a) zswap is in mainline, zram is not, (b) zswap can swap pages out to disk when it's full, zram cannot.

Also, I wouldn't really characterize the difference that zswap makes as a constant, workload-independent percentage performance boost. Rather, it increases the amount of RAM you can use before the system moves from the "acceptable performance" regime (minimal swapping) to the "dismal performance" regime (lots of swapping). For things like running Rails apps on a relatively small VPS, or getting the most out of a limited-RAM machine like an Eee PC or Raspberry Pi, this is very important.

Re: Ubuntu 13.10 (Saucy Salamander)

#175
post #82

I upgraded my 13.04 system this morning and now it is unfortunately unusable. Any time I try to switch users, it consistently brings me to a black screen with a frozen mouse pointer that I cannot get out of, even when hitting Ctrl+Alt+F#. I'm downloading the iso now to try a fresh install.

Mine (Asus Zenbook ux31a) doesn't even boot to dekstop anymore with the default kernel. X server just says fatal error, no screens found. Using kernel 3.8 now and things seems to work.

And it's a kernel bug: https://bugzilla.kernel.org/show_bug.cgi?id=59841

Re: Ubuntu 13.10 (Saucy Salamander)

#176
post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess we'll never know if Apple engineers were "inspired" by Zram and Zswap Linux development. I don't think anything like this is available in Freebsd yet. http://lists.freebsd.org/pipermail/freebsd-performance/2012-...

There have been countless research papers on this topic, so I doubt it -- http://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&q=dynamic+memory+com... . Not to mention the fact that RAM compression was quite common back in the DOS/Win95 days: http://oreilly.com/centers/windows/feat/softram/dblscan.html

Yes, and that's exactly what makes it curious. It's a technology who's always been "known", but no modern operating system has bothered implementing it. Now we got two major OS shipping it at the same time, and I can't even see a correlation with a change of hardware (i.e. i can't see RAM being lately more scarce on PCs or Macs to the point of making this feature more useful than, say, 2 years ago, or 4 years ago, or 6 years ago).

Re: Ubuntu 13.10 (Saucy Salamander)

#177
post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All of your complaints seem to be about the defaults. That's fine, but I don't see that it makes sense to switch distribution because you don't like the defaults, given that all the other options are available inside Debian and/or Ubuntu as well. There's Xubuntu, Lubuntu, Ubuntu GNOME, Kubuntu etc. all of which have different desktop environment defaults, enthusiastic developers who look after it. Some intend to swit…

ripb "All of your complaints seem to be about the defaults." Only one of five is a default issue and I even declared it a default issue and how I go around defaults. 1. Mir is a huge mistake (My opinion) 2. Unity (Well I am tiled window manager (i3) guy now so all DEs) I really don't like the flow of OS X and it is starting to really look more like OS X. DEFAULT an easily be changed. 3. Lack of community between the…

> 1. Mir is a huge mistake (My opinion)

Defaults. Kubuntu developers have said that they will not be using Mir. Thus I expect X/Wayland to be available in the repositories and used by default by alternative flavours.

> 2. Unity (Well I am tiled window manager (i3) guy now so all DEs) I really don't like the flow of OS X and it is starting to really look more like OS X. DEFAULT an easily be changed.

Defaults. Alternative Ubuntu flavours provide alternative DE defaults.

> 3. Lack of community between the Linux ecosystem. Millions is spent on Ubuntu but seems like little makes it upstream.

I addressed this separately.

> 4. Software Center. They need to just take OpenSUSE's one-click model and get rid of their current model of App Store and the horrible app model. (My model)

Defaults. You can use whichever front-end to apt you wish; Software Center is just the default. If there's an alternative available in Debian, Ubuntu has it. Examples: Synaptic, gdebi-gtk. Sure, they aren't complete replacements. But if a suitable Free alternative is written, I expect that it will be packaged in Debian and be available in Ubuntu.

> 5. Their Developer SDK to "Write once, run everywhere."

Defaults. You don't have to use their developer SDK (except perhaps for apps that will work on Ubuntu Phone through the default app store; but then other distributions have no answer to that, do they?). Traditional dependency and package -based development is still available and is not going away.

Ubuntu are adding to what was there previously. They are not replacing things, except that they are using their new stuff as the default. Your complaints are about what Ubuntu are doing; except that all the traditional stuff that other distributions have are still available. This is why your arguments still boil down to arguments about defaults.

Re: Ubuntu 13.10 (Saucy Salamander)

#178
post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder what they will do after 23.10 . :D

They'll be closed source by then so it won't matter.

"Ubuntu software is free. Always was, always will be." --http://www.ubuntu.com/about/about-ubuntu/our-philosophy

From that page, it is clear that Ubuntu uses the FSF definition of "free" (and quotes it).

The suggestion that Ubuntu will be closed source in the future is FUD. Everything that Canonical ships in Ubuntu is open source with an open bug tracker and open version control.

(with the exception of proprietary drivers and Flash, etc, written outside the project, done for pragmatic reasons and optional with a clear option at installation time; this stuff has not increased but reduced in scope with things like nouveau available now).

Re: Ubuntu 13.10 (Saucy Salamander)

#179
post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So what? These aren't criticisms of today's release at all. Mir isn't even used in 13.10. I don't think there are any distributions which ship with i3 so you would have to install i3 in any case, that isn't a fault of Ubuntu's and since you are not using it anyway, who cares if it looks like OS X to you? Ubuntu's work is open source, the code is there under a liberal license, what do you even want? If you don't like…

So what? These aren't criticisms of today's release at all. Mir isn't even used in 13.10 BUT they are spending resources on Mir WHEN they could have just gone with Wayland.

> BUT they are spending resources on Mir WHEN they could have just gone with Wayland.

They can spend resources on what they like. This isn't a zero sum game. This doesn't take other Free software away from you. This doesn't remove other Free software from Ubuntu's repositories.

> they could have just gone with Wayland.

I don't pretend to understand the technical details. But they seem to be the only ones pushing a full traditional distribution onto a phone. They've made it happen.

This is Free software. You go use Wayland on your phone that you don't have and enjoy whatever full traditional Linux distribution that doesn't exist there, and I'll use Mir on the phone I can have today and enjoy a standard Linux distribution on it.

Re: Ubuntu 13.10 (Saucy Salamander)

#180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's just beyond retarded. I weep when people have been conditioned by Canonical (and Microsoft) to accept this.

It's not all Canonical's faults. A highly customized install with a few extra libs here and there and some proprietary softare can easily wreck havoc on a system.

My Debian installation has been the same for six years and survived moving from Gnome → XFCE → Fluxbox → Awesome and installing bleeding-edge mesa and radeon drivers, plus other kinds on tinkering. Oh, and moving to an SSD.
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