Good Old Excel is the Ultimate Data Visualization Tool • Hacker News Board

Re: Good Old Excel is the Ultimate Data Visualization Tool

#11

Post by pfortuny » Wed, Oct 16, 2013, 4:21 PM UTC

cyrillevincey wrote: post #5

pfortuny wrote: post #3

Lighting everything is a fashion which will disappear. People need to BE ABLE to read as FAST as they can. Light fonts are that perk which makes things 'look' great but convey little information. Otherwise, great and clear ideas.

I think that using gray scales actually focuses the user on more valuable assets on the data visualization. But you're right, it's also a fashion. Thanks for your comment.

Oh, I intended to say "gray color for text" (which makes it less readable) and got confused, sorry :)

I liked your post a lot, anyway.

Re: Good Old Excel is the Ultimate Data Visualization Tool

#12

Post by pfortuny » Wed, Oct 16, 2013, 4:28 PM UTC

danso wrote: post #4

Excel is not at all a bad visualization tool...it's just that the lowest-common denominator of white-collar types use it, hence, the seemingly many terrible examples. By the time you're skilled enough to figure out R or D3, you're less likely to do something completely ugly...often because it's hard to add flair. However, D3 is starting to see way too many people who think adding force-directed balls is a good visual…

Despite not liking the NYT example (too much clutter to my sight and using faces conveys little information because they are difficult to match and to distinguish), I really look forward to an age in which data analysts treat readers as intelligent and show data as data, not as nice plots.

The problem with charts is twofold:

a) They are very very easily turned into ideological tools.

b) They are very very easily turned into 'kitsch' pastiches made by uninformed people trying to make beautiful-looking summaries.

Look at the charts here (population density http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Population_density): is it good or bad to have a population density of >500? Is it even good or bad to have it at 41-500? What would you have thought if the colors were reversed? Compare with this one (deforestation http://www.cryonie.com/en/world/images/map-deforestation.jpg): is it good or bad to have forests?

Re: Good Old Excel is the Ultimate Data Visualization Tool

#13

Post by cyrillevincey » Wed, Oct 16, 2013, 4:36 PM UTC

peatmoss wrote: post #10

cyrillevincey wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

ggplot2 and Tableau are high-end tools, meant for experts. My intent here is to show that an average organization can do a pretty good job with the tools they already have. The data discovery tech we're baking will actually totally simplify the way people visualize / discover their data. But until it's shipped, I'm just claiming people can use excel. Thanks anyway for your comment.

And I can appreciate that, though you can see why the sensational title might confuse someone on the intent. Also, I'd argue that Tableau doesn't require any particular expertise beyond what is required for Excel. Though Tableau isn't my preferred tool, I've seen great results come from total novices. It has the side benefit of sneakily training people to "think beyond the canned" and to develop novel visualizations…

"Certainly the business people who power our economy and command great sums of wealth are capable of such modest feats?" => unfortunately no, IMHO. I used to be a consultant, and I can tell from experience that there's no chance that any tool like R could possibly penetrate an audience of business people... Though, I share that dream with you!

Re: Good Old Excel is the Ultimate Data Visualization Tool

#14

Post by cyrillevincey » Wed, Oct 16, 2013, 4:37 PM UTC

kfk wrote: post #9

The problem with Excel is not visualization, it's sharing and updating. If you want to compete in visualization, look at Power Point, not Excel. I really look forward the day somebody tackles the issue of sharing/updating spreadsheets across many users that speak different languages, are in different countries, etc.

That's our vision at qunb! :)