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After 180 Websites, I’m Ready to Start the Rest of My Life as a Coder

blog.jenniferdewalt.com

131–140 of 383 posts

Re: After 180 Websites, I’m Ready to Start the Rest of My Life as a Coder

#131
post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just make sure you don't live in those cities proper :P

You can do it there too. I'd guess the average entry-level programmer in SF makes 80k a year. 2000/mo on rent (which is honestly a pretty nice place if you're sharing) leaves you with 20k to play with while still saving netting about 20k after taxes. Of course, if you live in the valley, you could save more , but the point is to illustrate that many (single, no dependents) tech workers can live in SF and still save.

I don't see how the numbers work out that well.

http://www.payrollforamerica.com/calculators/California-payr...

suggests the numbers are: $13.4k to feds, $5k social security, $1.1k medicare, $5k california, $800 CA SDI

Leaving you with $54,725.

$24k to housing and $20k to savings would leave you with just over $10k to eat, shop, pay for transportation, etc. So, don't try to have a car. Even carless, though, it seems much easier / more likely / more realistic to do it the other way around - $20k on food/entertainment/shopping/etc and $10k to savings.

Re: After 180 Websites, I’m Ready to Start the Rest of My Life as a Coder

#132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>But a person who is making any real effort would not find it difficult. As long as they don't have a family or want to build equity in a home. The justifications for the costs in this thread are so myopic that it's baffling.

I guess if you plan on remaining an entry-level engineer for your whole life, it would indeed be difficult to afford a home in SF. (This bit about family and house is known as "shifting the goal-post," btw. We're talking about the ability of a single engineer to save six months' living expenses.)

Assuming a promotion is known as "shifting the goal-post" too. You are essentially saying you are correct as long as you make more money than the original amount specified.

Okay, you said it's trivial for an entry-level engineer to save six months living expenses. That's $12k for housing and ~$4k for food and transportation. That's the majority of the leftover money after rent, taxes, transportation, and food for a year without any savings. I'm not sure you are correctly using the term 'trivial'.

Re: After 180 Websites, I’m Ready to Start the Rest of My Life as a Coder

#133
post #38

I don't know why she has never mentioned someone she worked with at all. I commented about this about her 70 days ago. --- So let's see her repository ( https://github.com/jendewalt/jennifer_dewalt ). This girl not only became a competent front end developer in 100 days, but looking at the Gemfile, she knows how to use capistrano, redis, capistrano, paperclip, omniauth and devise? She knows the best practices for Rai…

She's a she. It fits into the whole hacker news agenda of championing women in tech. The fact it's not true doesn't really matter. If a man had done the exact same project, no one would care. So, well done her for being a woman.

[deleted]

Re: After 180 Websites, I’m Ready to Start the Rest of My Life as a Coder

#134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nope. That's why the no dependents part is essential. If you are single and willing to live with roommates, you will be able to navigate the "high cost of living" pretty successfully. I'm living quite comfortably in San Francisco and spending a fraction of what I was spending in Texas. Why? - No car. No gas. No upkeep. No payments. No insurance. No inspections. No car. - Roommates. I HATE living alone so this was a n…

>They were wrong, and I was a fool for listening to them instead of exploring it for myself. Don't make my mistakes. They were right if you ever want to have a family. You are building no equity in rent so you will essentially have to leave and start over somewhere else to have kids. Your story is fine as long as it ends with you being single and alone without any real assets.

It doesn't always make sense financially to buy a home, in fact several times in the last decade it was a really bad idea. Not to mention if you are young you should travel, find what makes you happy, not have all your assets and yourself tied up in a semi-illiquid investment that could leave you underwater.

Presumably, the person we are chatting about is striving to save money, they may be in stocks or bonds instead of real estate... which are sometimes, though not always a better investment. They are assets, if not real.

So, this hypothetical person will have at least six months of salary to put towards whatever they decide to when they settle down.

Re: After 180 Websites, I’m Ready to Start the Rest of My Life as a Coder

#135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you want to live in SF by yourself Oh, sorry, I thought we were talking about someone who is making the bare minimum effort to save money. My mistake.

That doesn't even make sense. If someone is making the bare minimum effort, then they would probably live by themselves. Are you sure you thought that message through?

No, if you live by yourself in SF, you are not making any realistic effort to save money, because you have not attempted to optimize your largest expense.

OK, I'm done talking about this shifted scenario from what we started talking about. When you want to talk about how hard it is to save money in SF if you actually make any serious effort, I'm happy to resume.

Re: After 180 Websites, I’m Ready to Start the Rest of My Life as a Coder

#136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess if you plan on remaining an entry-level engineer for your whole life, it would indeed be difficult to afford a home in SF. (This bit about family and house is known as "shifting the goal-post," btw. We're talking about the ability of a single engineer to save six months' living expenses.)

Assuming a promotion is known as "shifting the goal-post" too. You are essentially saying you are correct as long as you make more money than the original amount specified. Okay, you said it's trivial for an entry-level engineer to save six months living expenses. That's $12k for housing and ~$4k for food and transportation. That's the majority of the leftover money after rent, taxes, transportation, and food for a y…

No, it is not, because I am not assuming a promotion to prove my point re: whether you can save money in SF as a single engineer. You can. That's it.

Re: After 180 Websites, I’m Ready to Start the Rest of My Life as a Coder

#137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can do it there too. I'd guess the average entry-level programmer in SF makes 80k a year. 2000/mo on rent (which is honestly a pretty nice place if you're sharing) leaves you with 20k to play with while still saving netting about 20k after taxes. Of course, if you live in the valley, you could save more , but the point is to illustrate that many (single, no dependents) tech workers can live in SF and still save.

I don't see how the numbers work out that well. http://www.payrollforamerica.com/calculators/California-payr... suggests the numbers are: $13.4k to feds, $5k social security, $1.1k medicare, $5k california, $800 CA SDI Leaving you with $54,725. $24k to housing and $20k to savings would leave you with just over $10k to eat, shop, pay for transportation, etc. So, don't try to have a car. Even carless, though, it seems…

Granted. I was too generous on the housing budget, but too conservative on tax expenses.

Re: After 180 Websites, I’m Ready to Start the Rest of My Life as a Coder

#138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That doesn't even make sense. If someone is making the bare minimum effort, then they would probably live by themselves. Are you sure you thought that message through?

No, if you live by yourself in SF, you are not making any realistic effort to save money, because you have not attempted to optimize your largest expense. OK, I'm done talking about this shifted scenario from what we started talking about. When you want to talk about how hard it is to save money in SF if you actually make any serious effort, I'm happy to resume.

Read your own message. You said you said the following:

>I thought we were talking about someone who is making the bare minimum effort to save money

Do you know what the bare minimum effort means? You are the one suggesting bare minimum effort now.

Re: After 180 Websites, I’m Ready to Start the Rest of My Life as a Coder

#139
post #7

This is fantastic. Especially inspiring to me, more than the fact that she learned how to code, is the fact that she dove into something that she had no background in, and after 180 days she came out with a solid understanding of the basics of programming; enough to do stuff on her own (and, combined with her graphic design/illustration skills, probably enough to do freelance webdev or get a junior level position in…

Bravo! Very inspiring. It seems like the OP learned a lot about more than just programming: project management, developer psychology, the importance of shipping....

One thing did stand out to me:

Having to produce something everyday forced me not to get hung up on understanding all the details of how something worked.

This is actually one downside of this method. In the end you don't really learn anything deeply. In development, deep understanding does matter a lot. It matters for selecting the right tools, being proficient with them, and solving the problems that others can't.

Again, bravo to the OP!

Re: After 180 Websites, I’m Ready to Start the Rest of My Life as a Coder

#140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nope. That's why the no dependents part is essential. If you are single and willing to live with roommates, you will be able to navigate the "high cost of living" pretty successfully. I'm living quite comfortably in San Francisco and spending a fraction of what I was spending in Texas. Why? - No car. No gas. No upkeep. No payments. No insurance. No inspections. No car. - Roommates. I HATE living alone so this was a n…

>They were wrong, and I was a fool for listening to them instead of exploring it for myself. Don't make my mistakes. They were right if you ever want to have a family. You are building no equity in rent so you will essentially have to leave and start over somewhere else to have kids. Your story is fine as long as it ends with you being single and alone without any real assets.

I understand where you're coming from, but I've had over a decade of experience owning and managing both personal and rental real estate so I wanted to chime in.

> They were right if you ever want to have a family.

Not entirely. "Ever" is a really strong word. If you want to have a family later in life, that should not prevent you from living in places you'd like to experience. You will likely regret being so cautious at the exact time in your life when you had the least reason to be so.

> You are building no equity in rent

If you are saving a dramatic amount of money per month and putting that money away in savings or another investment vehicle, then I would argue that you very much are. People underestimate how little "equity" they actually build up when they didn't happen to buy before or early in a real estate bubble. In reality, the closing costs of acquiring the property, maintenance, insurance, and property taxes, and the (optional but likely) 6% sales commission the realtor takes when you decide to sell all add up and chip away at effective equity. True, equity will eventually outpace these costs, but the time that takes is a function of how well the market is doing and other externalities.

There's also a cost of liquidity. $10,000 sitting in a bank account at 0.1% is arguably worth more than $10,000 of equity in a house that might take 3 months to sell.

All of this means that unless you know you're going to buy a place and stay put for a while, you'd probably be better taking the cost difference and building "liquid equity" that you can use later.

> so you will essentially have to leave and start over somewhere else to have kids.

True, but that may be a complete non-problem depending on your disposition. Personally, I don't get attached to places. They're just boxes with soft places to sleep. Relationships make it a home. In my case, in the unlikely event I decided to start a family, I could buy a house relatively close to the apartment I live in now (if I so desired). I wouldn't call that starting over. By the way, I'd be able to buy that house because I was able to save a metric crap-ton of cash while living on next to nothing with cheap rent.

> Your story is fine as long as it ends with you being single and alone without any real assets.

As I believe I have demonstrated, you have no justification for this statement; none whatsoever. It's simply not the case that a person who choses to spend one part of his or her life saving money living with roommates in a fun town will be forever "trapped" by that choice.

Also, you might not have intended it this way, but that statement was mean-spirited.

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