Is Microsoft Actually Innovating? • Hacker News Board

Re: Is Microsoft Actually Innovating?

#21

Post by netsp » Thu, Jun 04, 2009, 12:00 AM UTC

philwelch wrote: post #14

tybris wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, but that's not how they run their business. You shouldn't expect Microsoft or Apple to be innovative, you should expect them to make a better product than everyone else and/or market it better than everyone else. Amazon.com did invent Cloud Computing, Philips did invent the CD, Sun did invent Java, Toyota did invent the hybrid, AT&T did invent the cell phone, Xerox did invent the GUI. Those are the companies that…

"Philips did invent the CD" A refinement on the laserdisc. "Sun did invent Java" A refinement on C, C++, and Smalltalk. "Xerox did invent the GUI" A refinement on Doug Engelbart's work at SRI. (Edit: Though many of the researchers working for him later went to PARC, I find no evidence that Engelbart himself ever did.) Now here's the real question. If inventing a new type of laserdisc that's five inches wide is innova…

I think you have crossed to arguing about words.

What do you mean innovation.

Re: Is Microsoft Actually Innovating?

#22

Post by paulgb » Thu, Jun 04, 2009, 12:26 AM UTC

incomethax wrote: post #9

mattmaroon wrote: post #8

"For example, no one wants an iPod. They never have." Obviously this guy has never watched a television. Apple spends hundreds of millions each year making sure people do want an iPod.

Apple doesn't spend its money making sure people want iPods, they spend their money making sure people want to listen to "the right song wherever they are," and making sure that the iPod is the device that lets them listen to "the right song wherever they are."

Even if this (dubious) claim is true, it doesn't negate Matt's point.

Re: Is Microsoft Actually Innovating?

#23

Post by mattmaroon » Thu, Jun 04, 2009, 12:39 AM UTC

incomethax wrote: post #9

mattmaroon wrote: post #8

"For example, no one wants an iPod. They never have." Obviously this guy has never watched a television. Apple spends hundreds of millions each year making sure people do want an iPod.

Apple doesn't spend its money making sure people want iPods, they spend their money making sure people want to listen to "the right song wherever they are," and making sure that the iPod is the device that lets them listen to "the right song wherever they are."

No offense, but that's stupid. Apple doesn't need to spend a dime "making sure people want to listen to 'the right song wherever they are'". People have probably wanted that since wars were fought with sticks and have expected it since the Walkman in the '80s. That's like saying Coke's ad budget is an attempt to convince people to drink something when they're thirsty.

They spend their money on branding ads, to make sure that when people think about "listening to 'the right song wherever they are'" they associate that with an iPod. That's the only explanation, since everybody has known what an iPod is for years and yet they still spend literal hundreds of millions per year on ads for them.

Re: Is Microsoft Actually Innovating?

#24

Post by aswanson » Thu, Jun 04, 2009, 1:09 AM UTC

aswanson wrote: post #13

icey wrote: post #2

I do feel like Microsoft has been listening to what its consumers are asking for more than it used to. I think they got humbled by Vista more than they'd like to admit.

Microsoft needs to stop this genuine validation shit before they get a class action against them on it. I paid for a PC two years ago that worked up until last night when I got greeted with this: http://social.microsoft.com/forums/en-US/genuinevista/thread... Never mind the recovery process now that they don't even ship some computers with the OS disk.

Update: The bastards are magnanimous enough to allow a special mode where a browser can be used to go to pay for a genuine liscense, but no way to restore what you already paid for. So not only do they accuse customers of theft, they hold your pc hostage to extort more from legitimate users. I despise them. Do not trust MS with any data you have.

Re: Is Microsoft Actually Innovating?

#25

Post by netsp » Thu, Jun 04, 2009, 1:53 AM UTC

rudyfink wrote: post #20

netsp wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People like things.

This certainly seems to be true of some people. I have lost count of the number of times I have heard the phrase "retail therapy" used.

It's hard to give someone "the right song at any given moment in time anywhere they are at without any device whatsoever" for Christmas.

Re: Is Microsoft Actually Innovating?

#26

Post by Tichy » Thu, Jun 04, 2009, 8:05 AM UTC

I think it is just dumb to claim that Microsoft doesn't innovate. Comparing them to Apple is also a bit like comparing Apples and Oranges (pun intended).

Re: Is Microsoft Actually Innovating?

#27

Post by zcrar70 » Thu, Jun 04, 2009, 12:02 PM UTC

aswanson wrote: post #24

aswanson wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Microsoft needs to stop this genuine validation shit before they get a class action against them on it. I paid for a PC two years ago that worked up until last night when I got greeted with this: http://social.microsoft.com/forums/en-US/genuinevista/thread... Never mind the recovery process now that they don't even ship some computers with the OS disk.

Update: The bastards are magnanimous enough to allow a special mode where a browser can be used to go to pay for a genuine liscense, but no way to restore what you already paid for . So not only do they accuse customers of theft, they hold your pc hostage to extort more from legitimate users. I despise them. Do not trust MS with any data you have.

So did you actually have a genuine copy of Windows on your PC? Why did it suddenly stop working, was it due to an upgrade or something?

As an aside, I don't actually think it's unfair for MS to block access to Windows to users who are using illegal copies of Windows. It's their product; it stays their property so long as you haven't pay for it. If you don't like that, use something else instead (like Linux for example) or pay for the license.

Please note I'm not accusing you in particular of using an illegal copy of Windows. I'm just expressing surprise at people getting outraged when their PCs stop booting up into Windows because they have invalid licences (there was a story in China recently, which as I remember it was reported with glee by one of the Mac sites.)

(PS you could always load up the hard disk on another machine and copy the data from there)

Re: Is Microsoft Actually Innovating?

#28

Post by aswanson » Thu, Jun 04, 2009, 7:06 PM UTC

zcrar70 wrote: post #27

aswanson wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Update: The bastards are magnanimous enough to allow a special mode where a browser can be used to go to pay for a genuine liscense, but no way to restore what you already paid for . So not only do they accuse customers of theft, they hold your pc hostage to extort more from legitimate users. I despise them. Do not trust MS with any data you have.

So did you actually have a genuine copy of Windows on your PC? Why did it suddenly stop working, was it due to an upgrade or something? As an aside, I don't actually think it's unfair for MS to block access to Windows to users who are using illegal copies of Windows. It's their product; it stays their property so long as you haven't pay for it. If you don't like that, use something else instead (like Linux for exampl…

I have a valid liscense that came with the OEM HP computer. Still have the receipts. Vista worked for 2 years until last night when it became invalid and accused me of theft.