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Drug addiction: The complex truth

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Re: Drug addiction: The complex truth

#131

Post by ljf »

peller wrote: post #124
bdamm wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The religious basis of AA (Alcoholics Anonymous), after which nearly all 12-step programs are modeled, does not require "accepting Jesus as your savior". It does require, however, accepting that a "higher power" might restore you to sanity. This is a very important distinction, because AA goes to great lengths to clarify that the "higher power" is one of your own understanding. It is not Jesus, it is not a Christian-…

This. If you're not religious, community can be your higher power. The point is more that will-power alone is not enough for some people.

I agree, but would say this its not that will power alone won't work, but that some people don't believe in the power of there own will, and need to submit (at least to start with) to another force. Once people break the cycle they can come to realise that they do have the power within them.

Re: Drug addiction: The complex truth

#132

Post by svantana »

geoka9 wrote: post #70
1337biz wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For example, she found a puzzle game on her phone that she would play obsessively Actually an interesting observation on how difficult it is to draw the line between obsession and passion. It seems that she (can devlop) an extremely high level of focus, something that what would probably regarded by many as a trait for becoming successful in a specific discipline.

Yes, that's what I thought, too. If only she could bring herself to getting hooked on a creative endeavour, she would achieve remarkable results.

The problem with that is the delayed gratification - most productive endeavours these days require months on end of hard work before any reward can be expected - especially if you start out as a non-expert.

Reminds me of the famous toddler marshmallow experiment - how kids able to endure delayed gratification tend to be more successful later in life.

Re: Drug addiction: The complex truth

#133

Post by juretriglav »

codesuela wrote: post #90
guerrilla wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To me, this and the parent post are the most interesting thing here. I find myself to be quite like the parent's family member in that all that I do is obsessive, often to the point of self-destructive results. It's always been this way with work and hacking (to the extreme) and certainly for other less productive things like alcohol, food, news (ctrl-R) and especially television/films. What I'm wondering is if we co…

habitrpg.com

Great and free. Thanks for this, I'm giving it a try. I was _this_ close to building something similar myself, glad I found a really good version already built. :)

Re: Drug addiction: The complex truth

#134

Post by darkspaten »

cgore wrote: post #84
AznHisoka wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ha. I wanted to edit my post and add "(And please don't say God)". So the answer is no :)

That is basically the point of Ecclesiastes. King Solomon had access to everything, being king of one of the most powerful kingdoms of the time, worked his way through that whole list, and then at the end decided it was all pointless. He was a smart Paris Hilton, just with more money and absolute power.

And the most oft-repeated phrase in Ecclesiastes is, "Eat, drink, and be merry"

Re: Drug addiction: The complex truth

#135

Post by Alex3917 »

zafka wrote: post #126
Alex3917 wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Gabor Mate discusses this in his Angry Ghosts book. If you search through my comments for his name, there is a link to an interview where he discusses this also.

I did not find your comments, but I did a quick google search. Here is one refutation that I found: http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/addiction-in-society/201... It says just about what I would have guessed too. :)

What's the point of reading a refutation if you haven't read the original? You don't even know what you're reading.

Re: Drug addiction: The complex truth

#136

Post by bdamm »

ljf wrote: post #131
peller wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This. If you're not religious, community can be your higher power. The point is more that will-power alone is not enough for some people.

I agree, but would say this its not that will power alone won't work, but that some people don't believe in the power of there own will, and need to submit (at least to start with) to another force. Once people break the cycle they can come to realise that they do have the power within them.

That's the rub, though; for whatever reasons, physical or psychological or both, some people do not and cannot provide enough will power alone and need help.

This is why addicts talk to other addicts; because other addicts "get it" and can provide help in overcoming the problem that isn't just "learn how to use your own will power". That's just condescending.

It's obvious, really; if it were that simple, there would be a great deal less addicts in the world.

Re: Drug addiction: The complex truth

#137

Post by chas »

peller wrote: post #123
zafka wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This sounds rather much like speculation to me. Do you have any sources to back up your "Most" statement. Since the disease is generational, quite often children of addicts will have a stressful upbringing, but your theory of brain damage from stress causing the addiction is quite a stretch.

It's not necessarily always "abuse" so much as mis-parenting and/or unhealthy environments. I forget who said it but there's a quote that goes something like this: 'All healthy families share similar traits and patterns, but unhealthy families all have their own hosts of unique issues.' For one source that hit home for me, see Addiction as an Attachment Disorder by Philip Flores

That is the first line of Anna Karenina: "Happy families are all alike; every unhappy family is unhappy in its own way."

Re: Drug addiction: The complex truth

#138

Post by Semaphor »

berntb wrote: post #22
Semaphor wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nicotine itself (without the byproducts that happen when burning tobacco) is not even that bad [1] (deadly in relatively low amounts but unless you take it concentrated it's very hard to reach those levels). Unhealthy? Yes, but probably not much worse than caffeine [2]. Besides, Nicotine itself is not that addictive "Technically, nicotine is not significantly addictive, as nicotine administered alone does not produce…

>>[2]: Compare http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicotine#Pharmacology and http://www.energyfiend.com/harmful-effects-of-caffeine Cough, was that completely honest? since you linked to Wikipedia for Nicotine, I suspect you did know you'd get lots of really good effects by linking to Wikipedia for caffeine. :-) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Health_effects_of_coffee#All-ca...

Wikipedia had a lack of harmful effects of caffeine (or at least none written in a way I as a layman can understand) and I thought a site with articles about caffeine selling caffeine products would make an okayish substitution.

Again for nicotine there is no convenient list on Wikipedia, so:

> In one study, a group of Alzheimer's patients were given nicotine patches, while another received a placebo. Those with nicotine patches maintained their cognitive abilities longer and sometimes even recovered lost cognitive function.

> Contrary to popular opinion, the study showed that nicotine actually boosts the growth of new blood vessels.

> In 2006, Duke scientists found that people with depression who were treated with nicotine patches reported a decrease in their depressive feelings. The results were perhaps not surprising for a drug associated with imparting a "buzz." However, the research also showed a direct link between nicotine and an increase in the release of dopamine and serotonin, two vital neurotransmitters. A lack of dopamine or serotonin is a common cause of depression.

-- http://health.howstuffworks.com/wellness/drugs-alcohol/nicot...

again, there is much more on Google Scholar.

Re: Drug addiction: The complex truth

#139

Post by visakanv »

dusklight wrote: post #88
NotAnEngineer wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the rule, not the exception, among addicts. Every recovery program (12-step or not) emphasizes that drugs are not a drug addict's only problem. Obviously they are a very destructive part of the problem, but every addict who stops using long enough learns that -- surprise! -- they're still a self-centered, fear-driven, manipulative, obsessive person. That stuff doesn't just go away when you stop using; if anyt…

That's very interesting. Do you think addicts already have those personality traits from before they became addicted, or the traits developed as a result of the addiction?

I used to read obsessively as a kid. I also ate lots and lots of candy- I'd finish entire packets at one go. Went on to be an internet addict and cigarette smoker.

I think... I just never learned focus, discipline, self-control, portion-control, when to stop. I think it's a habit more than anything else. I think I've always had some "addictive" personality, but I think I could've kept it in better check if I developed habits of discipline and control- which I never really did.

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