Live data from Hacker News

Our Newfound Fear of Risk

schneier.com

171–180 of 195 posts

Re: Our Newfound Fear of Risk

#171
post #156
post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the only way humans could learn was through directly physical stimuli, we'd be scratching dirt and running down antelope still.

In theory, there is no difference between theory and practise. In practise, there is.

Even if, as I presume, you are trying to spell in Australian/Commonwealth English, it should be "practice" here because it's a noun. Only the verb is "practise".

Re: Our Newfound Fear of Risk

#172
post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In 1984, the US funded IRA bombed the entire UK government, nearly killed them all. The UK did not invade Northern Ireland or Ireland. The police investigated, made arrests and people were convicted. Acting humanely is not that hard.

It did not 'nearly kill them all.' It killed five people, none of whom where in the cabinet although they were senior party members. The UK didn't have to invade Northern Ireland because Northern Ireland was (and is) UK territory and there was already a substantial active military presence. For about 25 years the British army sent fresh soldiers off to do a tour in NI to toughen them up. In short, you have no idea wh…

Oh yes I do.

Sounds like you think the IRA were freedom fighters. Did you donate?

So, what is your definition of "nearly". The cabinet were in a hotel that had the holy crap blown out of it. What injuries would be good enough for you for "nearly"? We they not hurt enough for your definition? Or was it soem sort of collateral damage?

As it happens, I despised that Thatcher Tory government with a passion and always will. Trouble is, I tend to think targeting and NEARLY killing an entire government is probably worse.

On the other hand, two of my close relatives got hit by Harrods building materials as that blew up, and I was personally 15 mins off being blown up in the Guildford pub bombing. I experienced what US funded IRA were capable of.

Incidentally, to really mess with your head, I sort of support the idea of a united Ireland. Problem is, neither mainland Uk or Ireland actually wanted Northern Ireland... Glad we got the solution of self governance. It was always my logical solution. Govern yourself, and if you still want to blow each other up, well, go for it. Or, govern.

Buy yes my friend, I know a thing or two about Northern Ireland. And I will never ever forget, especially in this US age of "Terror", that the IRA were funded by American dollars, freely given by American people, not in any way frustrated by the US government.

Re: Our Newfound Fear of Risk

#173
post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm raising 5 of them in the States right now. I freely ignore most of these social mores. In our neighborhood my kids are among the most popular playmates. They actually went out and found friends so most of the children in the area know them. We don't trap them in the house and in fact frequently force them to leave so they aren't glued to the computer or Netflix. We've had broken bones, cuts, scrapes and other inj…

sounds like negligent parents waiting for a CPS visit to happen to enforce those social mores :) Fortunately, you seems to live among similarly "negligent neighbors". Once, we picked up an obviously lost dog on a mountain road and dropped it at the first fire station after the phone on its collar resulted in a voicemail. It was during our 1st year in the US and the thing "what if the dog was stolen and we stopped by…

We got visited once. Turns out the CPS for the most part isn't really interested in Parents who love their kids enough to let them experience a little pain. They were there less than 30 minutes.

Re: Our Newfound Fear of Risk

#174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That high-pitched noise you heard was the point, zinging swiftly over your head. All the pre-9/11 "experts" who told us to bend over and let the goat enthusiasts have their wicked way with us, didn't do so in a nuanced, situationally-aware fashion. They said, "always cooperate with hijackers." The fact that organizations existed the purposes of which were to kill Americans and destroy American resources, was blithely…

No, didn't miss the point - just didn't agree. Pre 9/11, we didn't have a plethora of "risk" experts telling us what to do. Most people listened to news - good, bad, or indifferent - parsed it for themselves and acted accordingly - not according to what the seldom-heard-from experts said.

How old are you? How long ago did you start watching the news? Because your rosy description of news media in times past does not accord with my recollection. Keep in mind that CNN started in 1980, and has always been a parade of blustery talking heads, in between the on-scene disaster reports. A particularly vivid memory of "expert" opinion (of risks to children), much hyped in the media, later debunked: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satanic_ritual_abuse#Investigat... Earlier in the last century "yellow journalism" featured the same sort of media output, but the reason that term fell out of use was not because Hearst died but because all journalism changed to that color. I mean, how was our war with Iraq different from our war with Spain?

It's tempting to see 9/11 as some sort of watershed, especially if it had a personal impact. In fact, it was just a bit more of the same. What the "experts" are telling us now, is also that.

Re: Our Newfound Fear of Risk

#175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My point is that whatever challenges renewables offer, they're out only hope Ok, we're on different pages then. I don't dislike renewables. I think at least one of them is probably the way of the future. I just dislike the black-and-white way renewables vs. nonrenewables are addressed.

I just dislike the black-and-white way renewables vs. nonrenewables are addressed. Then do some research. I've, literally, dedicated the past 9 months to figuring out what the hell is going on. And one way or the other, we're going to run out of fossil fuels in any practical economic sense (there will always be some coal, oil, and natural gas underground, but the ability to extract it and gain useful economic product…

You're so eager to defend renewables you're projecting opinions you want me to have, on me.

What I mean is I don't like how anything that is grouped into "renewables" is considered to be equally perfect. Like, "It's not fossil fuels so it's the holy grail". Nevermind that hydro backs up rivers and solar panels require rare earth metals. This sort of mindset, I figure, will hamper our ability to choose the best renewables. I'm not saying we should stick with fossil fuels.

Re: Our Newfound Fear of Risk

#176
post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Almost none of those are good ideas. You're right; riding in the back of a pickup truck is not a good idea. It's either a great idea and lots of fun for short distances on low-traffic roads at low speeds, or the only way to get work done because getting into and out of the cab takes too long. it's very easy for one momentary lapse to cause death or permanent damage in any of the others. As it is when swimming, hiking…

>As it is when swimming, hiking, driving, swallowing food, shaving, etc. Everything that's worth doing carries risk. I don't think I could die if anyone made a momentary lapse of judgment on hacker news; and yet here we both are.

I'm here too, but be aware that sedentarity is one of the greatest real threats to people nowadays (threadmill desks are still not widespread).

Re: Our Newfound Fear of Risk

#177
post #80

I think it's become a cultural thing, unfortunately. I've spent the last few years seeing the world, and the difference in attitudes between the people of many other countries and Americans at home is striking. We've become a fear-based culture. I have an anecdote from a month or two ago. My girlfriend--she's German--and I were in Boston's central park, where there's a wading pool for children. The place was extremel…

> Unfortunately I don't know what to do about it other than move to a different, more emotionally stable country. Culture is hard to change and takes a generation. That seems extreme. The situation you describe seems directly under control of the parents. Eg you can solve this for your child by simply not subscribing to that culture.

It's not that easy. Not subscribing to the culture of most parents tends to result into isolating your child.

Re: Our Newfound Fear of Risk

#178
post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The most unfortunate part isn't that we worry too much -- it's that we worry about the wrong things. Not enough people seem to be concerned about the unaffordability of health insurance, or the fact that 401k plans are unlikely to cover retirement.

I'm suspicious that this is constructed, and is precisely the idea. American TV is one long stream of things to be afraid of-- other than the things you should be afraid of. It's distraction.

I think people, deep down, know the difference between real and fake threats. People like getting worked up about fake threats, because they know they don't actually have anything to fear -- any more than from a scary movie. If the TV was always going on about real-life stuff that made you feel uncomfortable -- who wants to watch that?

Re: Our Newfound Fear of Risk

#179
post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

sounds like negligent parents waiting for a CPS visit to happen to enforce those social mores :) Fortunately, you seems to live among similarly "negligent neighbors". Once, we picked up an obviously lost dog on a mountain road and dropped it at the first fire station after the phone on its collar resulted in a voicemail. It was during our 1st year in the US and the thing "what if the dog was stolen and we stopped by…

We got visited once. Turns out the CPS for the most part isn't really interested in Parents who love their kids enough to let them experience a little pain. They were there less than 30 minutes.

i knew that! :) you're just lucky to have negligent CPS as well :) Sounds like you're living in Negligent State of America ... err ... scrap that, as it is from another opera

Re: Our Newfound Fear of Risk

#180
post #80

I think it's become a cultural thing, unfortunately. I've spent the last few years seeing the world, and the difference in attitudes between the people of many other countries and Americans at home is striking. We've become a fear-based culture. I have an anecdote from a month or two ago. My girlfriend--she's German--and I were in Boston's central park, where there's a wading pool for children. The place was extremel…

I completely agree, as someone who grew up in East Europe and is now in the US. The contrast between my childhood and what I see here is huge. And before someone counters that I come from an uncivilized place let me say what I saw 4 years ago while living in Amsterdam. Kids who were in 3rd or 4th grade would bike to school alone, crossing streets with traffic and so on.
Post reply on HN