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Defeated

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Re: Defeated

#181

Post by agentultra »

tinkerdol wrote: post #118
mosburger wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Extremely simple?" There's lots of reasons it isn't so simple for people. 1) Barriers to work and emigration 2) Language barriers - I know that learning a new language isn't impossible (I know a little Spanish but I'd hardly call myself fluent), but I speak only English fluently, which limits me to a handful of nations, many of which are nearly as bad as the United States (hey UK, how are those surveillance cameras?…

May I suggest Germany? At least in regards to your first point, they have recently relaxed barriers. Right now all you need is a four-year degree in order for you to come and look for work for up to 6 months. The chances of anyone reading this finding work are extremely high because there's a shortage of skilled professionals. http://www.make-it-in-germany.com/en/ Or, start out studying for a Master's degree first to…

I'm not an American, but one thing that bothers me about working abroad are the strict rules about levels of education. "You only need a four-year degree," is easy enough for someone who had the opportunities in life to go through that track. I have been very successful in life without a degree but attaining work visas is bloody difficult.

Re: Defeated

#182

Post by mkenyon »

flexie wrote: post #151
rayiner wrote: post #131

I just don't get the deal with the millimeter wave scanners. Did everyone raise a fuss like this when airports had you walk through metal detectors? How is a millimeter wave scanner different than a high-tech metal detector? Aren't we always talking about how the law needs to "catch up to technology?" Don't get me wrong, I think the TSA is a huge waste of money and I hate being ordered around by flunkies who can't ge…

They have to walk through metal detectors to buy books? I thought it was only for dangerous places like schools and offices. I can't think of anywhere in Europe we have those except for American embassies, a few courthouses, some government buildings and airports. Anyone knows when this started in the US and when it got so widespread?

I have let to see a local business in the US use a metal detector. Most will use shoplifting-detection gates at the exits. An "empty your pockets and purse" metal detector is terrible for business.

Re: Defeated

#183

Post by angersock »

arnarbi wrote: post #169
imsofuture wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not a metal detector, it's a system designed to scan for tagged items. My problem with the scanners is that they are invasive AND ineffective. They aren't protecting me, but they do train me to complacently subject myself as an innocent, not-charged-with-a-crime citizen to pre-emptive searches. That's just not alright by me.

I don't like them either, but why are they invasive?

Metal detectors (as memory serves) merely detect a change in inductance due to objects having a metallic composition. It's a purely passive system.

By contrast, the full-body scanners bombard you with very mild radiation and capture results, giving the operator a view of your body and whatever you have on your person.

It's a good deal more invasive.

Re: Defeated

#184

Post by jf »

eagsalazar2 wrote: post #125

"I won't be opting out again"? What? Give me a break. I fly weekly for work so I know the routine. 99% of the time the TSA agents are perfectly happy to do the pat down. I have had a few that have given me a hard time but then I've also had others come and apologize and emphasize that it is my right to opt-out. Keep opting out and next time someone gives you a hard time calmly ask for (1) a manager and (2) a comment…

I've also found this technique to be effective in getting a speedy opt-out: I get in line for the imaging machine; when I reach the front of the line, I firmly and loudly announce "OPT OUT"; they have me step aside; then I let 5 people pass me, get back in line, and repeat.

Re: Defeated

#185

Post by ekidd »

mosburger wrote: post #89
jballanc wrote: post #32

There is an extremely simple solution: leave. I've not lived in the US for almost two years now. I've only had to travel back twice in that time. Meanwhile, in the same time I've visited France, Belgium, the Netherlands, and Germany multiple times. None of those travel experiences were nearly as unpleasant or stressful as my two trips to the US. Furthermore, the technology communities that are growing up in these pla…

"Extremely simple?" There's lots of reasons it isn't so simple for people. 1) Barriers to work and emigration 2) Language barriers - I know that learning a new language isn't impossible (I know a little Spanish but I'd hardly call myself fluent), but I speak only English fluently, which limits me to a handful of nations, many of which are nearly as bad as the United States (hey UK, how are those surveillance cameras?…

2) Language barriers

Language is not an overwhelming barrier for a technology professional if approached correctly. Assuming you need to learn a major western European language, a good rule of thumb is 250 hours of work to become sufficiently conversational for shopping and travel, and between 500 and 750 hours to defend an opinion coherently on a day-to-day topic. (For a totally unrelated language, multiply by 4.) You'll still be at a linguistic disadvantage, but you'll be able to pick up the phone and deal with confused customer service representatives or whatever. Real ingrained fluency and an educated vocabulary takes longer, but most people are in excellent shape after a couple of years of immersion and a bunch of reading.

On the professional side, most HTLAL readers will be able to find jobs using large amounts of English. French programmers, for example, tend to read English fluently, attend talks in English (even at French conferences), and write some fraction of their code in English.

I learned this while trying to improve my technical French—I went shopping for French programming books, French programming podcasts, etc., and I would up finding (a) very few technical books, (b) French programming news aggregators with 60% of the links in English, (c) French programming conferences where every single speaker spoke English, and (d) lots of very friendly French programmers with English skills ranging from serviceable to excellent.

If you want to live in another country for a while, don't let language be the factor that stops you.

Re: Defeated

#186

Post by Tichy »

Really overly dramatic. Just because they are nice enough to say "use of the machine is optional", you are not losing your rights if eventually you have to pass through. What if they had never put that option on display to begin with. Would you then have decided to never fly again? Are airport checks in general a violation of our rights?

I don't know what measures are effective - apparently a lot of procedures at the airport are not effective. But in general I would say if safe flights require procedure X, it is not a violation of our rights if airports require procedure X.

Just because the government erred in one direction (too much intrusion and security checks), doesn't mean that to oppose it we should demand the complete absence of security checks.

Re: Defeated

#187

Post by praptak »

SkyMarshal wrote: post #146
raverbashing wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with the general spirit of your post, however: Amsterdam Schipol has (a lot of) scanning machines as well. Germany has more freedom in certain areas and less freedom in others. (you can't take your empty bottles to the recycling bins on Sunday for example)

> you can't take your empty bottles to the recycling bins on Sunday for example I don't know Germany but it seems you're suggesting Germany curtails freedom in the name of economic efficiency, but not as much as the US for "national security" and what not.

> it seems you're suggesting Germany curtails freedom in the name of economic efficiency

Not even that. I believe it has to do with Ruhezeit (Quiet Time.) It's just that rattling the bottles is noisy, so it is more like curtailing freedom in the name of neighbors' freedom to have their Ruhe.

Re: Defeated

#188

Post by Vivtek »

jballanc wrote: post #32

There is an extremely simple solution: leave. I've not lived in the US for almost two years now. I've only had to travel back twice in that time. Meanwhile, in the same time I've visited France, Belgium, the Netherlands, and Germany multiple times. None of those travel experiences were nearly as unpleasant or stressful as my two trips to the US. Furthermore, the technology communities that are growing up in these pla…

Yeah - re-entering the US is feeling more and more like entering an armed compound. I distinctly don't like it.

Re: Defeated

#189

Post by Ziomislaw »

eddieroger wrote: post #162
coldpie wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The people operating the naked scanners are literally ex-pizza-delivery-dudes: http://www.loweringthebar.net/2010/07/tsa-advertising-job-op... Highly trained professionals, these are not. They're just people working their nine-to-five to get a paycheck. We pass dumb customer support tickets around the office all the time; why shouldn't they pass around hot chick photos, etc?

Cops are 9-to-5ers as well. Should we not trust them to do their job and keep us safe? They didn't walk on the job with no training - maybe the ex-pizza dudes got trained as well. Also, comparing security photos and helpdesk tickets is a bad comparison, regardless of the similarities.

is this why the crime rate in USA is so high? because from 5 to 9 there are no cops?

Re: Defeated

#190

Post by einhverfr »

bane wrote: post #102
raverbashing wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with the general spirit of your post, however: Amsterdam Schipol has (a lot of) scanning machines as well. Germany has more freedom in certain areas and less freedom in others. (you can't take your empty bottles to the recycling bins on Sunday for example)

I'd also add that the three worst travel experiences I've ever had were: immigration at Paris Charles de Gaulle Airport, anything at all London-Heathrow, immigration at Toronto Pearson. Schiphol, El Prat, Marco Polo, Dublin, da Vinci, Kloten and Munich get me in and out without any fuss at all. Though security at Schiphol was about what you'd contend with at Dulles. Domodedovo and Koltsovo are very mediocre and busy,…

> I'd also add that the three worst travel experiences I've ever had were: immigration at Paris Charles de Gaulle Airport, anything at all London-Heathrow, immigration at Toronto Pearson.

Funny, my only complaint about Toronto was that the immigration officials tried hard enough to avoid charging me the work permit fee that it wasted a bunch of our time.

Best experiences though have been Singapore and Kuala Lumpur. Worst experiences have been Houston and JFK NYC. Sea-Tac is ok aside from the body scanners.

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