Soylent: What Happened When I Stopped Eating For 2 Weeks • Hacker News Board

Re: Soylent: What Happened When I Stopped Eating For 2 Weeks

#301

Post by IanCal » Wed, Aug 21, 2013, 4:47 PM UTC

gnaritas wrote: post #294

IanCal wrote: post #238

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn't require much attention though. Boil kettle, drop eggs into water on the stove, leave for 5 minutes. Put steaks on a foreman grill, take off when done. I'm pretty sure I can do this with less than 60 seconds of attentive time, the rest can be spent catching up on tech stories, pull requests or whatever. Frying it all would be even easier, too. Heat pan, put steak and eggs in, leave for a couple of minutes.…

You've missed the point of fast. It's not about attentive time, it's about total time and not cooking. What you suggest fails on all counts. People who want fast want it because they're in a hurry, often because they're running late for something. They don't have time to boil water or prep a steak. Love my foreman, but it takes a solid 4 minutes cook time and 10 minutes rest time to make a proper steak, that's not fa…

> They don't have time to boil water

I refuse to live a life where I regularly cannot find time to boil water. That's just absolute insanity.

> but it takes a solid 4 minutes cook time and 10 minutes rest time to make a proper steak, that's not fast.

If we're comparing it against eating soylent, then I don't think resting it is going to be vital. An unrested steak is still tasty, which means we're talking about 4 minutes.

Maybe we've got vastly different ideas of "quick".

Re: Soylent: What Happened When I Stopped Eating For 2 Weeks

#302

Post by Retric » Wed, Aug 21, 2013, 4:47 PM UTC

asdasf wrote: post #300

Retric wrote: post #293

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did you even try google? Enshure: http://ensure.com/products/ensure-complete-shakes click buy online from the product page. Fortisip: http://www.fortisipdrink.co.uk/ . Again, click the buy online link from there homepage. (Though I think this is a UK brand.) PS: You can find a wide product range at http://abbottstore.com/

Did you try reading the thread you are attempting to participate in? The whole problem is vaguely claiming that there's already products that cover the use case of soylent, but not giving a specific. None of the products you linked to provide 100% of known essential nutrients. None of them are intended to be used as a replacement for food, and none of them can be used as such with long term safety. It is absurd to se…

None of the products you linked to provide 100% of known essential nutrients. None of them are intended to be used as a replacement for food, and none of them can be used as such with long term safety.

No, that's almost exactly what these products are designed for.

EX: Similac, Complete nutrition for your baby's first year.

It should be noted that most of these are balanced nutritionally but not calorie wise because it's easy to backfill empty calories with soda etc and people generally drink quite a few extra calories. But, you really can live off of ensure complete and empty calories or just ensure if you don't mind spending more money.

Re: Soylent: What Happened When I Stopped Eating For 2 Weeks

#303

Post by IanCal » Wed, Aug 21, 2013, 4:53 PM UTC

Steko wrote: post #32

beering wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Soylent fans would argue that this alone is a valid benefit of Soylent - reasonable, healthy nutrition that takes no planning or decision-making, and is cheap and easy. Getting people to eat better is not an easy problem to fix. (BTW, it's also easy to paint restaurant food as bad, without actually examining why. It's also easy to make unhealthy home-cooked organic food.)

"reasonable, healthy nutrition that takes no planning or decision-making, and is cheap and easy." You can't say it's cheap because it's not being sold to consumers. There's a promotional price that works out to $10 a day which is cheap but not out of line with similar products. "reasonable, healthy nutrition" give the benefit of the doubt here. "no planning" - doubtful, it's a powder mix you make into shakes. That re…

I wouldn't consider $10 a day cheap. That'd add up to $600 a month for me and my wife, and that's way more than our current food budget (including delivery, beer, wine, fresh roasted coffee and more luxuries).

I assumed it was going to be way cheaper than that.

Re: Soylent: What Happened When I Stopped Eating For 2 Weeks

#304

Post by asdasf » Wed, Aug 21, 2013, 5:10 PM UTC

Retric wrote: post #302

asdasf wrote: post #300

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did you try reading the thread you are attempting to participate in? The whole problem is vaguely claiming that there's already products that cover the use case of soylent, but not giving a specific. None of the products you linked to provide 100% of known essential nutrients. None of them are intended to be used as a replacement for food, and none of them can be used as such with long term safety. It is absurd to se…

None of the products you linked to provide 100% of known essential nutrients. None of them are intended to be used as a replacement for food, and none of them can be used as such with long term safety. No, that's almost exactly what these products are designed for. EX: Similac, Complete nutrition for your baby's first year. It should be noted that most of these are balanced nutritionally but not calorie wise because…

Isn't silly nonsense like that supposed to be reserved for reddit? You are of course fully aware that I, and everyone else in this discussion, is over the age of 1.

How is 13% of one micronutrient and 65% of another balanced? In order to get complete micronutrient coverage from ensure, you have to drink 5 a day, putting you at risk of overexposure to manganese assuming you drink water still.

Re: Soylent: What Happened When I Stopped Eating For 2 Weeks

#305

Post by bsbechtel » Wed, Aug 21, 2013, 5:20 PM UTC

kamaal wrote: post #233

bsbechtel wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>That’s not a good reason to not try to innovate. Innovation only really works if you're solving a problem. I don't really see much of a problem with our food/nutrition system as is. Yes, there are parts of the world where people are starving, so maybe there is an application for this there, but if the aim is to test this product out in the Bay Area, I don't really see it going anywhere. I could be wrong, but that's…

>>Yes, there are parts of the world where people are starving There is nothing like a food shortage in the world. There is problem with food distribution, often because its expensive to send food from point A to B and no one is ready to pay for it. The solution is to find those people jobs so that they can buy food. It has more to do with economic policy.

I know this as well as anyone...worked in agriculture for a long time. I was just trying to be succinct, that's why I didn't specifically say food shortage. Jobs help, but there are some serious technological hurdles that hinder food storage in the developing world, making it unreasonably expensive. If this stuff can be made in bulk for cheap and has a long shelf life, that's where I'm thinking it could be useful. Disclaimer - I only skimmed the article, so some of these details on the cost and shelf life could be stated and I missed them.

Re: Soylent: What Happened When I Stopped Eating For 2 Weeks

#306

Post by Retric » Wed, Aug 21, 2013, 5:40 PM UTC

asdasf wrote: post #304

Retric wrote: post #302

Earlier quoted context omitted.

None of the products you linked to provide 100% of known essential nutrients. None of them are intended to be used as a replacement for food, and none of them can be used as such with long term safety. No, that's almost exactly what these products are designed for. EX: Similac, Complete nutrition for your baby's first year. It should be noted that most of these are balanced nutritionally but not calorie wise because…

Isn't silly nonsense like that supposed to be reserved for reddit? You are of course fully aware that I, and everyone else in this discussion, is over the age of 1. How is 13% of one micronutrient and 65% of another balanced? In order to get complete micronutrient coverage from ensure, you have to drink 5 a day, putting you at risk of overexposure to manganese assuming you drink water still.

Ahh, ok your assuming nutrients all need to hit exactly 100% each day to be heathy. The reality is perfection changes with age, Heath issues, pregnancy, sun exposure, body weight, and a host of other issues. However, close enough is plenty to stay in good heath. So, while there is no diet that works equally well for a nursing mother and a sedendary accountant both can stay heathy eating just rice and a multivitamin or enshure and some empty cal.

Re: Soylent: What Happened When I Stopped Eating For 2 Weeks

#307

Post by stcredzero » Wed, Aug 21, 2013, 5:51 PM UTC

w1ntermute wrote: post #41

alphaoverlord wrote: post #9

I'm all for people having the freedom to eat whatever they want and I really like the quantified self aspect of seeing how diet affects how they feel and metrics of health, but I have to say the author grossly does not understand the medical tests he had done and misinterprets the data. I'm not going to comment on the drink, but rather on his misunderstanding of medicine. First, EGFR is not "Epidermal Growth Factor R…

One of the best parts about this whole Soylent debacle is getting to watch well-known people make complete fools of themselves by commenting on things that they clearly know absolutely nothing about, but still feel like they have the right to make authoritative statements on.

> One of the best parts about this whole Soylent debacle is getting to watch well-known people make complete fools of themselves by commenting on things that they clearly know absolutely nothing about, but still feel like they have the right to make authoritative statements on.

One of the worst parts is watching how ill equipped most of society is to detect something is off-kilter. This pretty much applies to anything requiring technical understanding beyond that required to visit a mall.

Re: Soylent: What Happened When I Stopped Eating For 2 Weeks

#308

Post by stcredzero » Wed, Aug 21, 2013, 5:54 PM UTC

scotty79 wrote: post #245

jacques_chester wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Funnily enough, that's the whole pitch for Soylent. "I'm just a smart guy with a fresh pair of eyes who spent a few weekends reading undergrad textbooks and skimming pubmed". Not: "we're a large company with deeply-interested professionals who've made this their life's work, our own multi-million dollar labs and decades of accumulated experience in the development, testing, validation and manufacture of temporary foo…

> Not: "we're a large company with deeply-interested professionals who've made this their life's work, our own multi-million dollar labs and decades of accumulated experience in the development, testing, validation and manufacture of temporary food substitutes". Because that's boooorrrrinnnng. I think it's not because it sounds boring but because it sounds like a marketing bullshit. Guy in a suit tells you "trust us,…

> don't expect much from industry after McDonalds and sugar everywhere

Sometimes a fresh set of eyes are valuable, because the industry culture has developed some pathologies. Sugar in the food industry is a prime example.

And sometimes, it's just a cover for charlatans.

Re: Soylent: What Happened When I Stopped Eating For 2 Weeks

#309

Post by stcredzero » Wed, Aug 21, 2013, 5:57 PM UTC

lsc wrote: post #198

StavrosK wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What are they? I'm interested in "I'm too lazy to cook today but don't want to eat unhealthy fast food" food.

Seriously? You are unaware of meal replacement bars and drinks? https://www.google.com/search?q=meal+replacement+shakes Almost all of them are marketed to the diet crowd. There are a bunch of 'atkins' branded bars, too, if you are going the low-carb route. Slim-fast, I know, can be had in giant tubs for relatively little money per serving; I remember as a kid, looking through my grandparent's pantry and finding a gia…

> marketing it to hackers is a new thing, and something I, personally, would have never considered, and the guy is doing a hell of a job of it

Really, it's textbook. He's using his ties and understanding of a subculture demographic to market to it specifically.

Re: Soylent: What Happened When I Stopped Eating For 2 Weeks

#310

Post by gwern » Wed, Aug 21, 2013, 5:58 PM UTC

marze wrote: post #84

alphaoverlord wrote: post #9

I'm all for people having the freedom to eat whatever they want and I really like the quantified self aspect of seeing how diet affects how they feel and metrics of health, but I have to say the author grossly does not understand the medical tests he had done and misinterprets the data. I'm not going to comment on the drink, but rather on his misunderstanding of medicine. First, EGFR is not "Epidermal Growth Factor R…

Nice job missing the forest but spotting a few trees. I see some promising initial signs given the short duration of the trial. Imagine if there was a new drug that gave the mental benefits the guy reported after two weeks of use and saved you money too. It would be front page news. The guy doesn't claim to be a medical expert, he just did his best to report the results of a bunch of miscellaneous tests that were sug…

> Imagine if there was a new drug that gave the mental benefits the guy reported after two weeks of use and saved you money too. It would be front page news.

He used

> Finally, I took some tests on Quantified-Mind.com to measure my mental alertness while I was eating my typical diet of burritos and Diet Wild Cherry Pepsi. In this way, I could try to reproduce Rhinehart’s claim that Soylent improves mental acuity.

Those tests tend to exhibit substantial practice effects until you've done them a lot.

And then there's the obvious placebo effect. I present to you a training regime which due essentially to an expectancy effect by subjects can increase your IQ by 9 points... or 2 points: http://www.gwern.net/DNB%20meta-analysis Quite a difference.