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“People simply empty out”

lettersofnote.com

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Re: “People simply empty out”

#231

Post by acqq »

reeses wrote: post #202
homosaur wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

100K is the point where you have the illusion of financial freedom because you can purchase a BMW, buy a nice home in a bland cul-de-sac with a bunch of nameless white dudes, and it's not until you're in your 40s and you're in danger to losing the job to a robot or a whipper-snapper that you understand that kind of "freedom" is actually enslavement. You made the wrong choice because you wasted your life buying plasti…

I like this because Bukowski's first purchases when he "made it" was a BMW and a house in a nice neighborhood. I'd write more but, as you say, we only get one chance at this and we're living in the best time ever.

Thanks!

http://bukowski.net/timeline/

Martin expresses concern for Bukowski's "image" when he buys a new BMW. Volkswagon Beetle is relegated to the garage.

Re: “People simply empty out”

#232

Post by tomp »

teeja wrote: post #137
philwelch wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's no state of nature where people are free from starvation without having to work. Even hunters and gatherers have to hunt and gather.

From what I've read, the hunter-gatherers still on Earth have to work about 2 hours each day. For everything. Of course they don't have all the fancy toys. Or the worries and medications. Running away from an existence you've never really been given time to understand. Bukowski's right about how it empties you out. But unless you're lucky as him, few options have been left you. The land's all owned, and the "hunting"…

> the hunter-gatherers still on Earth have to work about 2 hours each day

That's because they live in low numbers in tropical climates, where food is plentiful throughout the year and shelter is never needed.

Re: “People simply empty out”

#233

Post by Leander_B »

rollo_tommasi wrote: post #69
blackhole wrote: post #5

I feel like too many people get sucked into the idea of furthering their career, to the point that they forget to further their own life. What is the point of existence if we never get around to experiencing it? "It's not the things we do in life that we regret on our death bed, it is the things we do not." - Randy Pausch

I think you've missed the point of the letter entirely. It's not about people who are obsessed with their work, it's about people who have no choice in the matter.

No one has a choice, either born in US or Western Sahara. Hard to accept, but this is reality. Only most people think they have the illusion they have, but this is false. Even Bukowski is trapped, still needs to work/money for food and to live. Yes, he does what he wants, or has the illusion as I said above.

And a big grin at the people saying we working in tech can make a difference. Creating a new social photo sharing app is not changing the world. Get real.

As a trapped life, the closest you can do to live happy is to do as much what you want (again coming back to the above) while living in the system. And yes, working in tech gives yoy higher chances to live how and where you want, but it stops there.

The only way to escape is living separate, somewhere deep down a rainforest. But then what, die from a snake bite or die from fever. Sounds better, no?

Re: “People simply empty out”

#234

Post by tomp »

rphlx wrote: post #175
dsbmac wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It ends in global financial collapse. Then rises again! The US will gradually fade from dominance as every other leader before it. I wouldn't be surprised if we're witnessing it's decline right now. I don't see how it gets out of the major systemic mess it is in. Detroit, Louisiana, etc. is how it begins. A first world country bit by bit reverting to third-world status. Until some place has a successful anarchic-type…

Corruption and regulation are fast friends which usually encourage each other.

Only because without regulation, corruption cannot exist by definition; if killing is not illegal, mafia is not corruption, it's just evil.

Re: “People simply empty out”

#235

Post by goggles99 »

blackhole wrote: post #5

I feel like too many people get sucked into the idea of furthering their career, to the point that they forget to further their own life. What is the point of existence if we never get around to experiencing it? "It's not the things we do in life that we regret on our death bed, it is the things we do not." - Randy Pausch

How many hours per day have humans worked historically compared to now? Just to survive (not starve to death). Do you think man works more now than historically? Man was cursed (after expulsion from the garden of Eden)/ or evolved (depending on your beliefs) to work, a lot.

Re: “People simply empty out”

#236

Post by pja »

goggles99 wrote: post #235
blackhole wrote: post #5

I feel like too many people get sucked into the idea of furthering their career, to the point that they forget to further their own life. What is the point of existence if we never get around to experiencing it? "It's not the things we do in life that we regret on our death bed, it is the things we do not." - Randy Pausch

How many hours per day have humans worked historically compared to now? Just to survive (not starve to death). Do you think man works more now than historically? Man was cursed (after expulsion from the garden of Eden)/ or evolved (depending on your beliefs) to work, a lot.

Hunter-gatherer societies worked fewer hours and lived longer than agricultural ones & certainly worked far fewer hours than the average modern US worker.

You could regard the invention of agriculture as the curse which permanently excluded humankind from the hunter-gatherer Garden of Eden.

Re: “People simply empty out”

#237

Post by hamai »

prostoalex wrote: post #192
lsc wrote: post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>No one holds a gun to the consumer's head, they just convince themselves they need thing. Then they whine when they haven't saved more than 300k for retirement at age 50 and social security is looking rocky. I think that we in the tech industry are... different here. In other industries, there is a /lot/ of pressure to look the part (well, to look an /expensive/ part.) Have you ever seen a real-estate agent in a car…

"America is essentially about hustling, and that goes back more than 400 years. It’s practically genetic, in the U.S., by now; the programming is so deep, and so much out of conscious awareness, that very few Americans can break free of it. They’re really sleepwalking through life, living out a narrative that is not of their own making, while thinking they are in the driver’s seat. It’s also especially hard to break…

This post made me realize "Bad Faith" was translated to something different in my language.

Re: “People simply empty out”

#238

Post by goggles99 »

This guy worked at a bunch of "shitty" jobs. I think he would be better served advocating that people get a good education and perhaps end up doing something that they actually enjoy. Sorting mail and packing lighting fixtures sucks...

Don't force your reality on the rest of us Hank.

Re: “People simply empty out”

#239

Post by telephonetemp »

Leander_B wrote: post #233
rollo_tommasi wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you've missed the point of the letter entirely. It's not about people who are obsessed with their work, it's about people who have no choice in the matter.

No one has a choice, either born in US or Western Sahara. Hard to accept, but this is reality. Only most people think they have the illusion they have, but this is false. Even Bukowski is trapped, still needs to work/money for food and to live. Yes, he does what he wants, or has the illusion as I said above. And a big grin at the people saying we working in tech can make a difference. Creating a new social photo shar…

> Creating a new social photo sharing app is not changing the world. Get real.

What about a medical start-up or one to do with education?

Re: “People simply empty out”

#240

Post by lotsofcows »

mkrecny wrote: post #212
mkrecny wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I watched that. Here's my take: Fiance: I am and will continue to sleep with other men. Bukowski: You f ing w *re [kicks]. Relationships are hard. While I don't agree with physical or verbal abuse, I think in this case Fiance probably hurt Bukowski more with her words than he did with his kick. It certainly didn't seem like he was kicking her because he "thought it was funny to kick women".

Reason for downvote?

Apparently it's acceptable to downvote without providing an argument. It's anonymous and requires no thought so it's very popular.
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