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Every important person in BitCoin just got subpoenaed by NY financial regulators

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181–190 of 194 posts

Re: Every important person in BitCoin just got subpoenaed by NY financial regulators

#181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly how do they differ? My impression is that the net result (depreciation of cash assets) is the same.

Increasing the amount of available reserves doesn't really transmit to inflation as it's constrained by demand for loans. The loanable funds model which says that increases in reserves leads directly to increases in loans doesn't really apply under a floating-rate non-convertible currency regime.

Interesting, thank you.

Re: Every important person in BitCoin just got subpoenaed by NY financial regulators

#182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

(For Americans) If you earn income in bitcoins, you still have to pay tax in USD. If you earn income in Euros, you still have to pay tax in USD. Bitcoin does not absolve you of your tax obligations, even thought it might help you to evade them.

But do you pay based on what the bitcoin was worth in USD when you made the transaction, or when you pay your tax bill. Which exchange does that valuation come from?

Believe it or not, we've had taxes for a long time on non-dollar-but-store-of-value things whose values fluctuate over time. Bitcoin does not present any sort of radical new challenge to the tax system.

Re: Every important person in BitCoin just got subpoenaed by NY financial regulators

#183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1. Wealthy people hoard large sums of cash. 2. Banks stopped making most of their money from deposits a long time ago.

> Wealthy people hoard large sums of cash. I'm curious where you think they put all that currency. You could argue they're hiding it from the tax authorities by putting it in a safe deposit box, but by definition nobody knows how much cash there actually is in those boxes, and of course raising taxes on such cash hoards isn't going to affect such. > Banks stopped making most of their money from deposits a long time a…

Banks make money from charging you for the privilege of using your own money.

Monthly account-maintenance fee. ATM fee. Fee if you don't have direct deposit. Fee for cashing checks. Fee for using a teller. Fee if they process debits before credits so as to push you into overdraft even though, by chronological transaction order, you never overdrafted.

They don't make money by accepting deposits and making loans; they make money by squeezing fees out of people who don't have much money.

Re: Every important person in BitCoin just got subpoenaed by NY financial regulators

#184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nobody can force opensource code maintainers to build anything. More importantly, nobody can force all exchanges to run any particular code; exchanges can exist in any political jurisdiction.

Whilst way you say may technically be true, the government could just declare this: Each person must publicly declare the bitcoin addresses that they hold. Any legitimate business accepting payment in bitcoins can only receive bitcoins from other registered addresses, else they are black flagged and no longer a registered address. Now, your average business and the banks are not going to circumvent these rules. The B…

Which government would that be?

Re: Every important person in BitCoin just got subpoenaed by NY financial regulators

#185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Wealthy people hoard large sums of cash. I'm curious where you think they put all that currency. You could argue they're hiding it from the tax authorities by putting it in a safe deposit box, but by definition nobody knows how much cash there actually is in those boxes, and of course raising taxes on such cash hoards isn't going to affect such. > Banks stopped making most of their money from deposits a long time a…

Banks make money from charging you for the privilege of using your own money. Monthly account-maintenance fee. ATM fee. Fee if you don't have direct deposit. Fee for cashing checks. Fee for using a teller. Fee if they process debits before credits so as to push you into overdraft even though, by chronological transaction order, you never overdrafted. They don't make money by accepting deposits and making loans; they…

Key bank has free checking and free atm usage and free teller usage. Perhaps you should transfer your checking account there, especially since they're offering $200 for new accounts.

> they make money by squeezing fees out of people who don't have much money

They do make money from people who don't pay attention to their balance - regardless of whether they are poor or not.

> They don't make money by accepting deposits and making loans

That perplexes me since they constantly try to sell me loans.

Re: Every important person in BitCoin just got subpoenaed by NY financial regulators

#186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Wealthy people hoard large sums of cash. I'm curious where you think they put all that currency. You could argue they're hiding it from the tax authorities by putting it in a safe deposit box, but by definition nobody knows how much cash there actually is in those boxes, and of course raising taxes on such cash hoards isn't going to affect such. > Banks stopped making most of their money from deposits a long time a…

Banks make money from charging you for the privilege of using your own money. Monthly account-maintenance fee. ATM fee. Fee if you don't have direct deposit. Fee for cashing checks. Fee for using a teller. Fee if they process debits before credits so as to push you into overdraft even though, by chronological transaction order, you never overdrafted. They don't make money by accepting deposits and making loans; they…

Where does my bank make its money then?

https://www.coastcapitalsavings.com/Personal/Banking/Chequin...

Unlimited debit/atm/teller/billpay/cheque/dd/dw transactions, no minimum limit, no requirement for direct deposit (but if you use it, its free too), no monthly fee.

Re: Every important person in BitCoin just got subpoenaed by NY financial regulators

#187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

See my comment here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6204187 . It's pretty straightforward for the Government to come up with a scheme to defeat tumbling services. Just make it mandatory to only accept payments from whitelisted addresses. Banks and your average business are not going to go all cypherpunk and circumvent such laws.

Meet Zerocoin, the cryptocoin extension adding zero traceability transactions for the low low cost of a few extra bytes per transaction. http://zerocoin.org/

Correct me if I'm wrong, but zerocoin is essentially a formal, decentralised tumbling service, right? It runs parallel to bitcoin and people on bitcoin can choose to use it or not.

Under my scenario, if you used zerocoin, and anybody else using the service wasn't whitelisted, you would be blacklisted, since there would be a chain of coins being sent from non whitelisted addresses to yours. So it would just be up to you not to use it.

The key is at what stage the Government becomes involved. If they implemented this sort of proposal right now, they would just say "if you're using zerocoin, you'll likely be blacklisted- tough luck". If everyone starts using zerocoin, including all legitimate businesses, and then they try to regulate it- then people would have more power.

Re: Every important person in BitCoin just got subpoenaed by NY financial regulators

#188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Banks make money from charging you for the privilege of using your own money. Monthly account-maintenance fee. ATM fee. Fee if you don't have direct deposit. Fee for cashing checks. Fee for using a teller. Fee if they process debits before credits so as to push you into overdraft even though, by chronological transaction order, you never overdrafted. They don't make money by accepting deposits and making loans; they…

Where does my bank make its money then? https://www.coastcapitalsavings.com/Personal/Banking/Chequin... Unlimited debit/atm/teller/billpay/cheque/dd/dw transactions, no minimum limit, no requirement for direct deposit (but if you use it, its free too), no monthly fee.

Congratulations, you've got a relatively customer-friendly bank. If you think you can generalize from that to banking in general, you need to read up on what banks in general do these days.

Re: Every important person in BitCoin just got subpoenaed by NY financial regulators

#189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Banks make money from charging you for the privilege of using your own money. Monthly account-maintenance fee. ATM fee. Fee if you don't have direct deposit. Fee for cashing checks. Fee for using a teller. Fee if they process debits before credits so as to push you into overdraft even though, by chronological transaction order, you never overdrafted. They don't make money by accepting deposits and making loans; they…

Key bank has free checking and free atm usage and free teller usage. Perhaps you should transfer your checking account there, especially since they're offering $200 for new accounts. > they make money by squeezing fees out of people who don't have much money They do make money from people who don't pay attention to their balance - regardless of whether they are poor or not. > They don't make money by accepting deposi…

They do make money from people who don't pay attention to their balance - regardless of whether they are poor or not.

It is unfortunately the case that being poor is much more expensive than being rich. Banks on average know and take advantage of this.

Re: Every important person in BitCoin just got subpoenaed by NY financial regulators

#190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But do you pay based on what the bitcoin was worth in USD when you made the transaction, or when you pay your tax bill. Which exchange does that valuation come from?

Believe it or not, we've had taxes for a long time on non-dollar-but-store-of-value things whose values fluctuate over time. Bitcoin does not present any sort of radical new challenge to the tax system.

Ok, I had a feeling that would be already settled but a lot of people seem to think you should be paying taxes now and I don't see how can that can be done without knowing which of the many exchange rates to use.
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