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ElementaryOs Luna released

elementaryos.org

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Re: ElementaryOs Luna released

#231

Post by listic »

frozenport wrote: post #46
nosefrog wrote: post #16

Mark my words: elementary OS is going to be big. I was on a beta version of elementary OS a couple months ago, and it was like a breath of fresh air. elementary OS sets out to settle the number one complaint casual users have of other Linux distributions: design. Other Linux distributions look like a mish-mash of a bunch of different designs by many different people. elementary OS has a beautiful, striking, and (most…

I have never heard anybody say Linux doesn't look sexy. Remember when we were comparing Compiz to Windows XP, or Enlightenment to Windows 2000? Ubuntu is one of the few OSs that can pull a black theme. Linux problems include: 1. Hardware compatibility 2. Office compatibility (also Adobe + games) 3. Easy to mess up your system with no hope of fixing it I don't see how any of these address the problems with Linux. I ru…

Is Open Office Impress really that unusable that you have to turn to Windows for presentations?

Re: ElementaryOs Luna released

#232

Post by aksx »

ChuckMcM wrote: post #90

I look forward to an ARM version of this, one for Pandaboard and one for Raspberry Pi.

I am using the elementary theme on my pi. You can build most of the applications.(I tried building pantheon terminal, successfully)

Re: ElementaryOs Luna released

#233

Post by AJ007 »

ams6110 wrote: post #212
AJ007 wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hardware compatibility hasn't been an issue for me for years. Back in 2000? Yes, major issue. #2 -- Specifically Adobe applications & Excel present big roadblocks from companies rolling over from Windows on OSX. Much of the other software that stopped companies in the past is now web browser based. #3 -- Definitely an issue.

Isn't #3 largely attenuated by not giving users root? How do you mess up a system beyond the point of fixing it if you don't have root access? I've seen many users who have (but shouldn't have) Administrator on their Windows boxes mess them up beyond fixing, usually because of malware.

Yes but users still need to install new software and make basic changes. The complaint, as I understand it, is that when breakage occurs, for whatever reason that may be, you pretty much get locked out of your system. Either you have a lot of work to do to repair the issue or you may just need to do a re-install.

I am far from a Linux/Unix expert, but I think this has to do with updates and dependencies. Using an Ubuntu LTS release along with not messing with any of the system settings seems to be fairly fool proof. Windows has its share of problems but the only complete failures I have experienced in two decades of use were hardware or malware related.

Re: ElementaryOs Luna released

#235

Post by aroman »

minor_nitwit wrote: post #211
aroman wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We absolutely do not use the genie to minimize apps (nor is such functionality even available in the program we use for our dock, Plank), and in fact we came up with our full screen button months before Apple made that design change public. For proof (or at least evidence coupled with my personal assurance) of the latter claim, see this mockup[1] which was submitted July 10, 2010. That's 1 year and 10 days before OS…

What is this animation? http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=LjC...

That is not our dock, and that is not Luna. We didn't make that video. Apparently it was made by a fan who had built his own version of Luna using some of our software. I can assure you that genie animation is nowhere in any code elementary ships with.

Re: ElementaryOs Luna released

#236

Post by [deleted] »

StavrosK wrote: post #170
aroman wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I appreciate the input. All I can really say is that you have to remember elementary is not a business. We don't have investors. We don't aim for market share or target X number of users by X date. Fundamentally, we build what we think is best, and if other people find it valuable too, they use it. So far, it's worked. So "user acquisition" isn't really a concern for us, though frankly, I believe it should be. And un…

I don't really know what people are complaining about. You're making something amazing that people really really need, you are doing it with donations (as far as I understand, anyway), and it's not like you set out to copy Apple wholesale. I think the benefits far outweigh any drawbacks (I can't really see any), so you'd probably do well to ignore the negative feedback and keep doing what you're doing.

[deleted]

Re: ElementaryOs Luna released

#237

Post by msutherl »

aroman wrote: post #152
msutherl wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a certain downside to mimicking the OS X design that you may not be taken full account of, which is that for people who have used OS X, your designs look like a not-quite-perfected copy. It's a sort of uncanny valley thing that manifests itself likewise in the common discussion of whether something feels "native", or whether you should use the OS-provided UI elements vs. re-invent the wheel when writing an ap…

I appreciate the input. All I can really say is that you have to remember elementary is not a business. We don't have investors. We don't aim for market share or target X number of users by X date. Fundamentally, we build what we think is best, and if other people find it valuable too, they use it. So far, it's worked. So "user acquisition" isn't really a concern for us, though frankly, I believe it should be. And un…

> So "user acquisition" isn't really a concern for us

Than why have you released the project to the public, made a nice website for it, made documentation, etc? Why do something good in the world if you don't care if it benefits people? Rather, if you've done something that you hope will benefit people in the world, don't you think you should try to benefit as many people as possible? The design choices you've made encode that goal, wittingly or unwittingly.

Indeed you are as biased as possible, which is why you have to listen to others if you hope to have any true understanding of your situation. Take what I said into consideration – it effects the spread and usefulness of your efforts whether you care or not.

Re: ElementaryOs Luna released

#238

Post by msutherl »

munchor wrote: post #175
StavrosK wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't really know what people are complaining about. You're making something amazing that people really really need, you are doing it with donations (as far as I understand, anyway), and it's not like you set out to copy Apple wholesale. I think the benefits far outweigh any drawbacks (I can't really see any), so you'd probably do well to ignore the negative feedback and keep doing what you're doing.

>so you'd probably do well to ignore the negative feedback and keep doing what you're doing. That's us, thank you.

Given the choice between doing what you're doing now and doing something better, what would you choose? Certainly I am not deriding the Elementary team for copying OS X. It's definitely 'not cool', but open source since GNU has always been about copying the hard work of others and the net effect in this case is that users get well considered graphic design for free (or $10 I suppose). I'm complicit in that, so we pass over it in silence. But I am trying to show that roughly copying another interface has a certain effect – beyond the inherited good properties of the original design – on the user that is problematic. Differentiating yourself from other products has a purpose beyond 'just being different': avoiding the uncanny valley.

In other words, this is constructive criticism. Don't ignore it because it's "negative" and you're doing something "positive". All progressive positive things are born out of a criticism of the existing state of affairs. Any effort can be improved. If you ignore criticism – not just mine – you are doomed to stagnation!

Re: ElementaryOs Luna released

#239

Post by samstave »

aroman wrote: post #137
millstone wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OS X System Preferences screenshot: http://imgur.com/RLB8JZp ElementaryOS settings screenshot: http://i.imgur.com/vnjmHrQ.png It's got the same left-aligned, bolded categories, in the same order, with almost identical text. It even senselessly copied the choice of the Apple Magic Mouse as the mouse icon. That tiny smudge at the bottom represents the Apple logo! I don't mean to suggest that an ElementaryOS designer is…

As a matter of fact, I wrote that very program, Switchboard. It's getting late and I don't want to write a whole book about it's design (though I could), but basically here's the story: I saw some mockups Daniel Fore (the project's founder and lead designer) created for a hypothetical system settings app. Here's an example: http://danrabbit.deviantart.com/art/User-Accounts-Plug-19860... I set about coding the app. I…

Screw everyone. You guys shipped an OS.

Re: ElementaryOs Luna released

#240

Post by aroch »

aroman wrote: post #70
silverlight wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone who just watched the video but hasn't used it yet, that was my thought as well. Are they doing things design-wise and interface-wise that are different than OSX? Or are they simply aiming to re-implement OSX's GUI in Linux? (This is meant as an honest, non-sarcastic question, my curiosity is piqued but I'm genuinely wondering what their goal is)

Yes, absolutely we are doing different things. Examples include our launcher (from the top left hand corner), slingshot[1], our deprecation of the desktop as a place for folders, and our human interface guidelines. As another concrete example, we are very much trying to eliminate menu bars entirely. Instead, our apps use the "AppMenu"[2] -- a cog wheel that works similarly to Google Chrome. [1] Here's a video I found…

Slingshot looks pretty much like a non-fullscreen version of Launchpad[1].

[1]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/3/3c/Lion_Launchpad...

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