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Heart Surgery in India for $1,583 Costs $106,385 in U.S.

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Re: Heart Surgery in India for $1,583 Costs $106,385 in U.S.

#51

Post by noonespecial »

patio11 wrote: post #50

Somewhere there is a forum of doctors saying "Pfft, the US firm wants $100k for the patient records system and the Indian firm wants $1,000. Those greedy bastards! They live in a toxic industry which acts as parasites on us noble public servants saving lives every day. It serves them right to deal with international competition finally. Let's go with the Indian bidder. What could possibly go wrong."

Lots of stuff. But the question isn't about which of those two systems will be better in the end. The question is what to do when you've only got $75k.

Re: Heart Surgery in India for $1,583 Costs $106,385 in U.S.

#52

Post by [deleted] »

pliny wrote: post #12
bobdvb wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What incentive is there in the USA to reduce healthcare costs? The system is totally corrupt.

I don't know much about the American healthcare system, but wouldn't it be the same incentive when selling any product? If you sell the same quality product for cheaper, you will get more business than your competitors. That's what competition in a free market is, no?

[deleted]

Re: Heart Surgery in India for $1,583 Costs $106,385 in U.S.

#53

Post by hsuresh »

jmspring wrote: post #45
seanmcdirmid wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> A doctor trained in India is no less qualified than a doctor trained in the US. In general? http://blogs.worldbank.org/developmenttalk/shocking-facts-ab... > It’s also pretty staggering that hiring qualified staff doesn’t appear to increase this probability. Das and colleagues suggest that part of the issue might be the variation in the quality of instruction in Indian medical training institutions. So there may be…

If their doctors are trained like the bulk of their it professionals -- those hired by the body shops, no thanks. At least from what I've seen, countries that make a business iut of pudging grad numbers hoping for expat acceptance, quality is inversely proportional to quantity. Within the US, the cost of heart surgery is highly variable, but if I were to go international, i would go south/central America over India a…

Such a crass generalization. If you think the bulk of India's IT professionals are bad - then you should at least consider if such poor skills are "good enough" for a vast majority of IT work.

Re: Heart Surgery in India for $1,583 Costs $106,385 in U.S.

#54

Post by cygx »

pravda wrote: post #14

It's not greed, it's a consequence of health insurance. Get rid of health insurance and prices would drop 10x.

That's a convenient fiction. Care to back that up with some evidence?

In particular, how do you account for the fact that more health insurance (Europe, Japan) is less constly than the abomination known as the US healthcare system?

Re: Heart Surgery in India for $1,583 Costs $106,385 in U.S.

#55

Post by koralatov »

barking wrote: post #25

In my country I know of a hepatologist who claims to have seen higher than normal rates of hepatitis B amongst people who have travelled to lower cost countries for dental treatment. One country was mentioned in particular (not India as it happens).

Your comment left out the single most important piece of information: the country in which the treatment took place. I have no plans, and thankfully no need, to go abroad for low-cost treatment of any sort, but someone reading your comment might, and the key fact you omitted might stop them making a horrible mistake.

Re: Heart Surgery in India for $1,583 Costs $106,385 in U.S.

#56

Post by acchow »

kamaal wrote: post #42
DigitalSea wrote: post #9

The first supposed fact thrown around in the medical costs argument like this is, "Well in India their cost of living is lower, so they charge considerably less, yadda yadda..." but it's obvious the price difference goes way beyond any cost of living gap. That's over $100,000 in price difference, while it is true the cost of living (salary, prices of every day items) in India is considerably less than that of the US,…

>>You don't see this kind of innovation in the American health system because it has been engineered with greed in mind right from the start. As an Indian, I can tell you people here think the same about our health care system. The Doctor in discussion here, Dr Devi Shetty is a sort of a local hero here in Bangalore. And who knows in some years he might as well be a national hero. Its basically because he seems to br…

> You just feel its cheaper as $1 = 60 rupees. There you get a straight 60x value of your money. That is what it is at the end of the day.

I find the vast majority of people are tripped up by currency conversion, but I'm surprised to find this on HN. In Japan $1 = 100 yen, but certainly I don't feel I have 100x in buying power. A bowl of ramen will cost me $8 in SF; an equivalent bowl will cost me 800 JPY in tokyo.

Let's not even get started on the Korean Won...

Re: Heart Surgery in India for $1,583 Costs $106,385 in U.S.

#57

Post by barking »

kamaal wrote: post #42
DigitalSea wrote: post #9

The first supposed fact thrown around in the medical costs argument like this is, "Well in India their cost of living is lower, so they charge considerably less, yadda yadda..." but it's obvious the price difference goes way beyond any cost of living gap. That's over $100,000 in price difference, while it is true the cost of living (salary, prices of every day items) in India is considerably less than that of the US,…

>>You don't see this kind of innovation in the American health system because it has been engineered with greed in mind right from the start. As an Indian, I can tell you people here think the same about our health care system. The Doctor in discussion here, Dr Devi Shetty is a sort of a local hero here in Bangalore. And who knows in some years he might as well be a national hero. Its basically because he seems to br…

In agricultural terminology you can either pay people 'by the day' or pay them 'by the hundred yards'.

I have worked in both types of systems and can see merits and pitfalls in both.

In the former system there can woeful output whilst in the latter there can be woeful quality.

Neither of these are inevitable.

In a salary system, if the lazy/incompetent can 'get away with it' and the industrious/competent aren't acknowledged it has a poisonous effect on the organisation.

In a fee per item system the lazy will earn less automatically but there needs to be careful monitoring of the quality of the output with particular attention paid to people at either tail of the output distribution. Also people with high output (because of poor quality) can drive down wages for everyone and create a treadmill where the quality of everyones' work suffers as they try to maintain their income.

Re: Heart Surgery in India for $1,583 Costs $106,385 in U.S.

#58

Post by acchow »

pliny wrote: post #12
bobdvb wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What incentive is there in the USA to reduce healthcare costs? The system is totally corrupt.

I don't know much about the American healthcare system, but wouldn't it be the same incentive when selling any product? If you sell the same quality product for cheaper, you will get more business than your competitors. That's what competition in a free market is, no?

What free market? What prices? Free market from price shopping you say?

You got hit riding your bike and are bleeding profusely from your abdomen. The ambulance driver asks, "There's a hospital 6 minutes away but they don't post their prices publicly (who does?) and we've never brought anyone of your condition there before. We think it will probably cost between $500-$10,000. But there's a hospital 45 minutes away that we know for sure will cost $400-$800. What do you want us to do?"

Let's suppose the government mandates that all hospitals must post their prices publicly. But you're bleeding to death. Can you really go shopping now?

Re: Heart Surgery in India for $1,583 Costs $106,385 in U.S.

#59

Post by pacomerh »

Andrenid wrote: post #18
randomtree wrote: post #10

What is the survival rate in India after that procedure, comparing to the US? My colleague _visited_ India and returned with a stomach flu, spent a week in a hospital.

So because your friend ate some bad food, that country's hospitals must be unhygenic? Yup, I totally see the correlation there. I'm Australian, visited the US and got severe Salmonella poisoning in Vegas... the US must have really shocking road safety laws.

Same here, got salmonella in Los Angeles eating at a subway. Point being, you can get sick anywhere, other factors include your body getting used to new organisms.

Re: Heart Surgery in India for $1,583 Costs $106,385 in U.S.

#60

Post by pipirupirupi »

shameerc wrote: post #37

I'm just curious to know the situation in countries like Russia and China, because many of my friends took their medical degree from those Countries. Is is just the education is cheaper or entire industry?

>Is is just the education is cheaper

In Russia medical and other uni education free if you can pass entrance tests.

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