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Secure Ideas will not be presenting at DEF CON this year

blog.secureideas.com

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Re: Secure Ideas will not be presenting at DEF CON this year

#61

Post by ropman76 »

samstave wrote: post #10

I don't agree with the statement that Secure Ideas makes; they are opting out because DEFCON is supposed to be an open collaboration place, but if the very netsec community doesn't have the balls to stand up to the extreme over-reach of the NSA, then we are farked. Yes, most of us have known for years the extent of the spying the NSA/USG does -- and I believe it's time to take back some individual sovereignty -- the…

this is rank hypocrisy. The NSA is simply using what "security researchers" have been talking about at Defcon for years. One lone hacker gets into a telecom's system and he makes a name for himself (or herself). A government agency does it and everyone gets on their sanctimonious high horse when all the NSA is doing is taking hacking to its next logical step, government weaponization of hacking. .

Re: Secure Ideas will not be presenting at DEF CON this year

#62

Post by abalone »

They make a good point: DEF CON has not given "concrete" reason for why they banned the feds. They merely allude to "recent revelations".

I am not necessarily opposed to the idea of banning people for bad behavior, but DEF CON should spell out a concrete policy, apply it to everyone, and be specific about the offending actions.

Re: Secure Ideas will not be presenting at DEF CON this year

#63

Post by jivatmanx »

Nrsolis wrote: post #41
sanderjd wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sure this will just further your impression of the general sentiment, but I want to try to explain it as a US citizen. The biggest problem many people have with what the NSA has been revealed to be doing is that it breaks laws regarding the US government's ability to invade the privacy of its citizens, and it does so in secret, precluding real democratic oversight. While spying on foreigners may be unsavory, it d…

I agree with your sentiment. It's worthwhile to note that people have often stated that the Constitution is not a "suicide pact". We are free (as a people) do what needs to be done to preserve our union. Whatever your political persuasion, it cannot be denied that bad actors are trying to coordinate and plan attacks against "soft" targets inside the United States and abroad. This is not a theoretical problem. It's re…

"The Constitution is not a suicide pact" is a quote from Abraham Lincoln, as the civil war really was an existential threat to the union itself.

Similarly, the cold war was clearly an existential threat to the union itself, the most obvious example being the hundreds of nuclear ICBM's in Cuba.

Terrorism of the Boston Marathon sort is now an unfortunate reality, but is in no way comparable to these two events, and I simply don't see how it poses any existential threat to the union at all.

It's important to put things into perspective by understanding the threats we have faced in the past, and all that has been sacrificed to bring us the freedom we have now, so that we don't throw it away due to overreacting.

Re: Secure Ideas will not be presenting at DEF CON this year

#64

Post by D9u »

ropman76 wrote: post #61
samstave wrote: post #10

I don't agree with the statement that Secure Ideas makes; they are opting out because DEFCON is supposed to be an open collaboration place, but if the very netsec community doesn't have the balls to stand up to the extreme over-reach of the NSA, then we are farked. Yes, most of us have known for years the extent of the spying the NSA/USG does -- and I believe it's time to take back some individual sovereignty -- the…

this is rank hypocrisy. The NSA is simply using what "security researchers" have been talking about at Defcon for years. One lone hacker gets into a telecom's system and he makes a name for himself (or herself). A government agency does it and everyone gets on their sanctimonious high horse when all the NSA is doing is taking hacking to its next logical step, government weaponization of hacking. .

We the People don't take kindly to our elected and appointed Public Servants openly lying to us with impunity about programs which are most definitely against the spirit and intent of the Bill of Rights.

There's no comparison between some "lone hacker" and our own government entities.

The idea that we should accept what the NSA et al have been doing in our name simply because it might be the next logical step is preposterous!

The next logical step is extermination camps, and the parallels between our current IC & that of Nazi Germany are too numerous to ignore.

That our government wastes so much on these spy programs while simultaneously neglecting our own people is unforgivable.

Hypocrisy has no place in our government, but that's exactly what we have now.

Re: Secure Ideas will not be presenting at DEF CON this year

#66

Post by [deleted] »

bpatrianakos wrote: post #43
jgross206 wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Looks like somebody wants to nominate themselves for a government contract. Interesting how when the news media baselessly questions the motives of whistleblowers it's a "smear campaign." When someone on HN does it to someone who's vaguely pro-NSA it's the top comment.

He's not even vaguely pro-NSA. He's pro-openness. The fact that this is the top comment is sad and its a testament to knee-jerk reactions in echo chambers around the world. There's a difference between the government as an entity and individuals who are employed by them. Feds attending DEF CON aren't really Feds, their security guys like everyone else there. Depending on the context one could be a fed first and other…

[deleted]

Re: Secure Ideas will not be presenting at DEF CON this year

#67

Post by D9u »

thrush wrote: post #34
mullingitover wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> one of the largest problems with current state of technology is that what the fed is doing is possible. I think you meant 'legal' but you accidentally wrote 'possible' instead. Mesh nets and polymorphic encryption don't stand a chance against a supoena and the threat of a lengthy imprisonment/huge fine for noncompliance.

I said what I meant. And I think you're implying that the government doesn't use the same backdoors and web surveillance strategies that all black hats (anyone really) has the ability to deploy.

Do any "black hats" have direct access to fiber optic cables on the same scale as the NSA?

Re: Secure Ideas will not be presenting at DEF CON this year

#69

Post by malandrew »

By closing themselves to the US "feds" community, do they open themselves up to the larger international black hat community?

I would imagine that any foreign black hat would have reservations about going to DEFCON.

In fact, the DEFCON community probably benefits from diversifying globally by being held in other countries.

I don't know anything about DEFCON, but how diversified is the audience that attends? Historically, have the overwhelming majority of non-fed attendees been US citizens? I would imagine that both Germany and Israel are well represented in the community.

If so, how do they attend without risking being put on a no-entry list at the border?

Re: Secure Ideas will not be presenting at DEF CON this year

#70

Post by keppy »

thrush wrote: post #34
mullingitover wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> one of the largest problems with current state of technology is that what the fed is doing is possible. I think you meant 'legal' but you accidentally wrote 'possible' instead. Mesh nets and polymorphic encryption don't stand a chance against a supoena and the threat of a lengthy imprisonment/huge fine for noncompliance.

I said what I meant. And I think you're implying that the government doesn't use the same backdoors and web surveillance strategies that all black hats (anyone really) has the ability to deploy.

The stark difference being that no hacker has the ability to deploy a standing army, a secret police force, or secret courts for issuing secret warrants.
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