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Firefox OS devices officially released

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Re: Firefox OS devices officially released

#31

Post by fauigerzigerk »

AndrewDucker wrote: post #8

I'll be very interested to see how well these take off in the countries they're launched in. I don't see them as much of a competitor in the UK/US/etc.- the people there that want a smartphone have one that's much more higher powered. But in countries where most people can't currently afford smartphones, this offers them the chance of having one. And if they can then start to cannibalise sales from beneath, they have…

I don't believe people anywhere in the world will keep buying phones for $800. I believe this has been a fad and it's starting to fade.

Re: Firefox OS devices officially released

#32

Post by freehunter »

garysweaver wrote: post #26
PommeDeTerre wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Firefox OS will need to successfully compete against BlackBerry OS, Windows Mobile, bada and the other quite obscure mobile OSes long before it'll have a chance to even begin competing against Android or iOS. Many of these alternative systems have actually shipped on numerous devices, and have actual users. And how exactly is it "different"? Firefox OS is really just a limited subset of what we already have available…

> And how exactly is it "different"? Robert Nyman of Mozilla pointed me at this: https://blog.mozilla.org/ligong/2013/06/03/foxconn-joins-the... "Foxconn stated that they intend to have FFOS running on all categories of the “8 screen” devices, from smartphone to tablets to laptops to TVs and outdoor signage." Name me another mobile OS that will be running on laptops or outdoor signage. :) This, I think, is the bigger…

Android.

Re: Firefox OS devices officially released

#33

Post by Yoric »

PommeDeTerre wrote: post #19
pja wrote: post #12

Huge kudos to Mozilla for branching out and trying something different. I hope it works out for them: we could really do with an open competitor to the Google/Apple duopoly.

Firefox OS will need to successfully compete against BlackBerry OS, Windows Mobile, bada and the other quite obscure mobile OSes long before it'll have a chance to even begin competing against Android or iOS. Many of these alternative systems have actually shipped on numerous devices, and have actual users. And how exactly is it "different"? Firefox OS is really just a limited subset of what we already have available…

Oh, hello PommeDeTerre. Haven't we had roughly the same conversation last week on another thread?

> Firefox OS will need to successfully compete against BlackBerry OS, Windows Mobile, [...]

Yes, a new product needs to compete with existing products. That goes without saying.

> And how exactly is it "different"?

Frankly? Try it, you'll see. For me, it's different insofar as I can write a small game and self-publish it in a few hours. I don't have to pay anyone, I don't have to wait for anybody's permission (compare with iOS), I don't have to download a SDK, and my users will be able to run/install the self-published app immediately (compare with Android). Oh, and of course, my students can do the same, which is a big deal to me.

It's different insofar as an application written for FirefoxOS will also work on Android (and hopefully on iOS) and, in many cases, on your Desktop/Laptop. By opposition to what you seem to believe, this is not a design flaw. This is called not locking in your users. It's the kind of thing that Mozilla does.

It's different insofar as much of the development is done by the community of users. Not a privately-held company that decides what is best for us in terms of features or performance or privacy.

Oh, I almost forgot: it's different insofar as said company does not own all my private data by default.

> It's hard to see how it'll compete on vague notions of "openness" that most consumers really could not care any less about [...]

In the US, maybe. In India or Africa (or parts of China or Russia or Turkey ...), for instance? Not so. People care a lot about having a phone that they can use, which means first and foremost a phone that works in their language, even if that language is not a big commercial target. That's what openness is about, not about people like us squabbling on some high tech news aggregator.

> It can't even really compete on price, given the existence of Android.

Of course it can. On low-powered phones, FirefoxOS tends to outperform Android by a large margin. This means that you can have the same experience with cheaper phones.

Caveat: I'm a Mozillian.

Re: Firefox OS devices officially released

#34

Post by michael_h »

freehunter wrote: post #30
glogla wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I understand it correctly, Firefox OS is different in how it is not bound to one particular corporation. Mozilla's objective here is "build mobile OS" and not "sell more devices" like Apple or "get info on people so we can sell advertising" like Google. This makes me wonder about privacy and Firefox OS. Does it require arbitrary account with credit card paired like iOS or Windows Phone? Does it require account to…

Windows Phone does not require an account paired with a credit card.

Neither does iOS, for that matter.

Re: Firefox OS devices officially released

#35

Post by netcan »

ippisl wrote: post #21

I fail to see the value of such devices to the consumer. With android devices available at $100 with 1gb, android 4, a large screen, and huge market of highly optimised apps, what can Firefox is offer, except from marketing by carriers which are usually hated by consumers? liliputing.com/2013/06/android-gets-cheaper-meet-the-100-quad-core-phone-59-dual-core-tablet.html

I think you need to compare these to whatever low end android you are likely to find in a local retailer: galaxy mini, Xperia tipo, etc.

My guess is that Mozilla see the low end as the most vulnerable angle. Apple aren't going low end. Android aren't excluding it, but There is always demand at the lower end. Handset makers are happy to fill it. Android might be the best current option, but Google aren't focused on this segment specifically and I think most app developers are developing for high or midrange phones first. A lot of stuff doesn't work well on a cheap android. By focusing on less power and smaller screens, they will encourage developers to make simpler apps that run well on this hardware.

It's still early to tell if they have an advantage over android in this market, but it makes sense in theory.

Re: Firefox OS devices officially released

#36

Post by rimantas »

Yoric wrote: post #33
PommeDeTerre wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Firefox OS will need to successfully compete against BlackBerry OS, Windows Mobile, bada and the other quite obscure mobile OSes long before it'll have a chance to even begin competing against Android or iOS. Many of these alternative systems have actually shipped on numerous devices, and have actual users. And how exactly is it "different"? Firefox OS is really just a limited subset of what we already have available…

Oh, hello PommeDeTerre. Haven't we had roughly the same conversation last week on another thread? > Firefox OS will need to successfully compete against BlackBerry OS, Windows Mobile, [...] Yes, a new product needs to compete with existing products. That goes without saying. > And how exactly is it "different"? Frankly? Try it, you'll see. For me, it's different insofar as I can write a small game and self-publish it…

  > Caveat: I'm a Mozillian.
Oh. If your view resembles that of the most of mozillians then I think Firfox OS is already doomed. What you wrote might appeal to some developers, but it means little to users. And I am not sure how many developers are interested in platform in which users are not interested. Looks like when Blake Ross left Mozilla so did understanding the user.

Re: Firefox OS devices officially released

#37

Post by Yoric »

fauigerzigerk wrote: post #31
AndrewDucker wrote: post #8

I'll be very interested to see how well these take off in the countries they're launched in. I don't see them as much of a competitor in the UK/US/etc.- the people there that want a smartphone have one that's much more higher powered. But in countries where most people can't currently afford smartphones, this offers them the chance of having one. And if they can then start to cannibalise sales from beneath, they have…

I don't believe people anywhere in the world will keep buying phones for $800. I believe this has been a fad and it's starting to fade.

I wonder about that.

I see around me a few people replacing their work computer with a cellphone. That cellphone is more useful for them, cheaper, easier to carry and, with respect to what they manage to use it for, more powerful.

Of course, that's just a few samples, so I have no idea about general trends.

Re: Firefox OS devices officially released

#38

Post by Yoric »

michael_h wrote: post #34
freehunter wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Windows Phone does not require an account paired with a credit card.

Neither does iOS, for that matter.

It doesn't?

All recent MacBooks I have seen insist rather hard to be paired with an account and a credit card number. I have never done the initial setup of an iOS device, but I would have assumed that it was the same or worse.

Re: Firefox OS devices officially released

#39

Post by Yoric »

pjmlp wrote: post #23
PommeDeTerre wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Firefox OS will need to successfully compete against BlackBerry OS, Windows Mobile, bada and the other quite obscure mobile OSes long before it'll have a chance to even begin competing against Android or iOS. Many of these alternative systems have actually shipped on numerous devices, and have actual users. And how exactly is it "different"? Firefox OS is really just a limited subset of what we already have available…

Fully agree. It is great that Mozilla is fighting for openness, but in terms of what street joe and street jane want, I think it will join WebOS in a few months. Given my experience in telecommunications I don't see how sales are going to push these devices out of the shop when users come asking for other OSs.

What would you suggest?

Re: Firefox OS devices officially released

#40

Post by GFischer »

freehunter wrote: post #30
glogla wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I understand it correctly, Firefox OS is different in how it is not bound to one particular corporation. Mozilla's objective here is "build mobile OS" and not "sell more devices" like Apple or "get info on people so we can sell advertising" like Google. This makes me wonder about privacy and Firefox OS. Does it require arbitrary account with credit card paired like iOS or Windows Phone? Does it require account to…

Windows Phone does not require an account paired with a credit card.

However, it is VERY restrictive in its Live account interaction.

I had some very ugly experiences setting up one for my cousin (I stupidly didn't lie and registered her as being from Uruguay and under 18), which made the phone behave like a brick ("sorry, no apps available in your country", "sorry, you have to be over 18 under laws from another country to use most of the features of this phone").

Changing the Live account did not work, I had to reset the phone and create another account for her, lying about her age and country so the phone could work properly (she wanted to use Skype and WhatsApp, not exactly the most demanding use case).

That stupidity turned me off Windows Phone for the foreseeable future (although the hardware is top-notch).

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