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Stay-at-home dad

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Re: Stay-at-home dad

#161

Post by adrianbye »

Killah911 wrote: post #146
adrianbye wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

this doesn't happen in non feminist countries (ie usually 3rd world).

I'm not quite so sure that this is a 1st world thing necessarily. It think it's more of an American thing. During our last vacation in Europe, I was surprised by how people, even at random rest stops along the autobahn were interacting with my kids and did not feel threatened or run off with their kids b/c I was the one taking the kids to the play area. (Albeit, I wasn't the only father/male there) All things being e…

happens in europe, here's an example: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/10401416

Re: Stay-at-home dad

#162

Post by yaddayadda »

qznc wrote: post #30

Odd that stay-at-home women label themselves as "not working". I often try to convince my wife and others to proudly answer "mother" when asked for their work. It might not get payed, but it surely is a lot of work.

My first day of school (early 70's) the teacher asked something along the lines of "What do your parents do?". When I got home that afternoon my mom (a stay-at-home mom) asked about my first day of school, and I told her about that question. Of course she wanted to know what my answer was. For the 40 years since, I've suffered frequently for saying that she didn't work. ;)

Re: Stay-at-home dad

#163

Post by lotharbot »

Pxtl wrote: post #154

Stay-at-home dad fist-bump. Here in Ontario, parents have the right to split their parental leave. We did it the traditional way for the first two... for round three, we split it 60/40, and I got the big side. I wouldn't trade this for the world. My kids are juggernauts of exhausting destruction, but I knew this was my only chance to get this kind of extended time with them and I wanted it. One thing is that the only…

Sweat pants was me. I'm also scruffier than most geeks. And on the autism spectrum, and therefore have more awkward mannerisms and social habits than most geeks. None of which are really exactly the point.

I've seen other dads who are considerably less awkward in the same situation in the grocery store or at the park. Maybe it's different where you live, but here there's an expectation that men who aren't at work during the day are highly likely to be predators, or druggies, or something else unsavory. It doesn't seem to cross peoples' minds that a guy my age at the store at 11 am on a Tuesday could be just a normal dude who takes care of his own kids most of the time. Unless we have a kid with us, in which case we're clearly super-dad.

Re: Stay-at-home dad

#164

Post by argonaut »

adrianbye wrote: post #160
argonaut wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> and that margaret mead was basically a fraud? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coming_of_Age_in_Samoa https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Derek_Freeman Did you even read your own linked articles? Generally, Freeman's critique has not been accepted in the anthropological community. Several Samoan scholars who had been discontent with Mead's depiction of them as happy and sexually liberated thought that Freeman erred in the op…

you can see my link above to the NYtimes and the lack of research for the right in academia. there will be 10,000 papers supporting the left position to every 1 paper supporting the right position. they're just forced out of academia. this is a huge blind spot for society and is a little like how wall street wasn't prosecuted after the financial crisis. that derek freeman was successful in what he did (and he was, me…

Okay, it's pretty clear you didn't even read the articles you linked to.

Re: Stay-at-home dad

#165

Post by jemfinch »

cheald wrote: post #59
enraged_camel wrote: post #50

The part about being viewed suspiciously at the playground was particularly awful. Why is it that we as a society are so fucking fearful? We have an irrational fear of communists, socialists, terrorists, serial killers, sex offenders, and of course, child molesters and abductors. Everyone thinks that there is someone out there who is out to hurt them and their family. Like, that is the default assumption , and people…

Speaking as a dad, I hate taking my boys to the playground for the same reason. Moms see "man unaccompanied by woman, must be a predator" - I make a big show out of interacting with my boys and obviously being their father, but it's really grating that it's even necessary at all. As to the culture of fear, I blame local news. It's wall-to-wall with alternating RAPISTS EVERYWHERE and LOOKIT THE CUTE PUPPIES, because t…

I take my boys to the playground most days when I pick them up after work: my wife works later than I do, and it gives us something entertaining to burn the time until she gets home. I usually have my DSLR out with some sort of "stalker" lens (e.g. a 70-200mm[0]). If my boys want to play with me, I play--if they don't, I wander around and keep an eye from a distance. If someone else's kid needs pushed on a swing and I'm not busy, I give pushes. If someone else's kid needs help off the monkey bars, I help them down. I've never once felt like I'm under a microscope or anyone thinks "man unaccompanied by woman, must be a predator."

1. The feeling you have could be illusory. It's very possible that moms really aren't thinking that, and you're just a little paranoid. I know the feeling you have, because I had it at first as well, but I think it's seriously overblown and largely unjustified. Until someone actually tells me to get away from their kid--I'd be happy to oblige, of course--I'm reject those feelings for lack of supporting evidence.

2. I live in California--maybe that makes a difference.

3. I consistently go to the same park at around the same time. My wife once took the boys to the park on a day I needed to stay late at work and people came up to her and said, "I recognize your boys, but I don't think I've seen you with them before, you must be their mom." I don't know a single parent there by name, but they know my face and they see me parenting my boys on a regular basis.

The point I'm making is that you should try not hate taking your boys to the playground, and the best way to become comfortable with it is to take them more often and involve yourself in the ad hoc community that forms at the playground. You have nothing to worry about, and the more you go, the more you'll see that your concerns are unwarranted.

[0] Obligatory pictures of my awesome boys: http://www.flickr.com/photos/jemfinch/sets/72157634058745609...

Re: Stay-at-home dad

#166

Post by seanmcdirmid »

ceol wrote: post #136
seanmcdirmid wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where the heck did that come from? For example, China is arguably a very matriarchal society, and guys take their kids out all the time.

Are you talking about the Mosou? Because they're only about 40,000 strong in a country of 1.34 billion, and aren't even a true matriarchy, as political power tends to be in the hands of men.[0] If you're talking about the rest of China, the absence of modern women leaders has been a concern.[1] I don't see any way you could call China "very matriarchal". [0]: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mosuo [1]: http://behindthewa…

Leaders of the country are male. Leaders of the family are female.

Your point?

Re: Stay-at-home dad

#167

Post by jemfinch »

kbenson wrote: post #153
dquail wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Am I the only dad out there that constantly takes my daughter to the park / science center / library alone ... and doesn't feel the least bit weird about it? In 3 years I've received nothing but smiles and conversation for doing this. Maybe it's a Canadian thing ...

I was thinking the same thing, then I realized while I may not feel the moms at the park are suspicious of me, I am more ware of my actions while there, and may even go so far as to say something out loud to make it clear I have a child present (for example, call out to my son or daughter from where I am). The truth is, while they may not show any signs of being wary of me, I feel the need to assuage any concerns the…

I don't think that's strange, and I don't think it's bad: nor do I think it's something you're doing because you're a man.

Even in gathering of my closest friends, where we share implicit trust that every parent is looking out for all our children, I still take great care to be aware of where I'm placing myself relative to a parent and his or her child. If I find myself blocking some parents' view of his or her child, I move. I (obviously) don't do this because I think they'll suspect me of some malfeasance, but simply because I know they'll feel ever-so-slightly more comfortable being able to see their kid.

Playgrounds are the modern analog to a watering hole: an ad hoc "tribe" forms around them, and by making it clear that your kids are at the playground, you're saying, "I'm not an outsider, I'm a member of this tribe, you can feel comfortable with me." Women do exactly the same thing, it just manifests differently; usually in the form of smalltalk and mini-conversations with other parents.

Re: Stay-at-home dad

#168

Post by Domenic_S »

tokenadult wrote: post #81

It was way back in 1992 that I radically reshaped my career plans, coincident with the birth of my first son (who, gratifyingly, is now grown up and supporting himself as a hacker for a startup). I read the comments here, read the fine article, and still don't completely grok that I have had much the same experience without as much surrounding cultural baggage. Predominantly "stay-at-home" (a better term might be "ne…

Thanks for this. My wife stays home to take care of our newborn, we're strongly considering homeschooling, and it sometimes feels like a very lonely place out here in mega-career-driven SV.

Re: Stay-at-home dad

#169

Post by Domenic_S »

jpatokal wrote: post #122
IzzyMurad wrote: post #92

> being constantly alert A good or a retarded dad? I am not sure. What trouble a 0-4 month old baby could get into if you put him in a place where he could not fall?

to run toward me screaming with excitement after I'd been away for awhile Hint: That's not a 0-4 month-old child... and that's because dad took his four months off after mom had returned to work.

I was confused myself, to be honest. Eventually worked it out that this was later in the kid's life (who goes to a playground with a 0-4 mo old?), but it was a little confusing.

Re: Stay-at-home dad

#170

Post by specialist »

cheald wrote: post #59
enraged_camel wrote: post #50

The part about being viewed suspiciously at the playground was particularly awful. Why is it that we as a society are so fucking fearful? We have an irrational fear of communists, socialists, terrorists, serial killers, sex offenders, and of course, child molesters and abductors. Everyone thinks that there is someone out there who is out to hurt them and their family. Like, that is the default assumption , and people…

Speaking as a dad, I hate taking my boys to the playground for the same reason. Moms see "man unaccompanied by woman, must be a predator" - I make a big show out of interacting with my boys and obviously being their father, but it's really grating that it's even necessary at all. As to the culture of fear, I blame local news. It's wall-to-wall with alternating RAPISTS EVERYWHERE and LOOKIT THE CUTE PUPPIES, because t…

Speaking as a dad, I hate taking my boys to the playground for the same reason.

As a single dad, I never experienced that weirdness.

It might be a type thing. Kids, dogs, and moms love me. (But not ex-wives.)

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