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Battery Swap [video]

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Re: Battery Swap [video]

#141

Post by CamperBob2 »

JPKab wrote: post #133
robomartin wrote: post #121

As an engineer I would have preferred to have seen a shot from under the car showing the actual process. It's unfortunate that they chose to record it from a hundred feet away. As for the reality of this swap deal. Well, it sounds like a logistical pain in the ass. You are required to come back and get your original battery pack back or pay the difference in cost for the new one. Option number two could be in the tho…

I think the business model needs to mimic that of the BetterPlace idea: Users of battery swapping stations pay a monthly fee, and the battery is seen more as a commodity which is rented by the user, but owned by the company. Coming back to get a battery is absurd, and should never happen.

Exactly. I've had this debate/argument many times with HN'ers. For some reason, people around here are unnaturally attached to the idea of owning a particular car battery.

I've tried to see it from my interlocutors' point of view, but the point still isn't getting through to me, I'm afraid.

Re: Battery Swap [video]

#142

Post by justin66 »

robomartin wrote: post #121

As an engineer I would have preferred to have seen a shot from under the car showing the actual process. It's unfortunate that they chose to record it from a hundred feet away. As for the reality of this swap deal. Well, it sounds like a logistical pain in the ass. You are required to come back and get your original battery pack back or pay the difference in cost for the new one. Option number two could be in the tho…

> Well, it sounds like a logistical pain in the ass. You are required to come back and get your original battery pack back or pay the difference in cost for the new one.

I imagine they'll get rid of the "come back for your battery" functionality eventually. It's just kind of goofy and unnecessary.

Credit me if I get a slightly older/more worn battery than the one I was driving with, bill me if I get a slightly newer battery, and use this system as a way to pretty much eliminate the whole panic surrounding electric cars and what happens when the battery gets old and decrepit.

If the system demands a shorter lifecycle for batteries before they're reconditioned (as you'd really want to avoid DRASTIC differences in cost and performance between batteries of the same class when people pull into a station) it might add some cost to the overall system. I don't believe it will represent a profound increase in cost.

Re: Battery Swap [video]

#143

Post by smackfu »

robomartin wrote: post #121

As an engineer I would have preferred to have seen a shot from under the car showing the actual process. It's unfortunate that they chose to record it from a hundred feet away. As for the reality of this swap deal. Well, it sounds like a logistical pain in the ass. You are required to come back and get your original battery pack back or pay the difference in cost for the new one. Option number two could be in the tho…

I would have loved to see the details too. It takes a mechanic longer than 90 seconds to change a tire, so it's pretty impressive if they can really change a very heavy battery pack in that much time.

I suppose it's probably using tech similar to what's on a factory floor. If you need to fasten/unfasten twelve bolts, and you want to do it very fast, you just use twelve separate air ratchets on a tooling. If you need to move a thousand pounds of battery, you use an arm that is designed to do just that, and only that.

Re: Battery Swap [video]

#144

Post by smackfu »

lnanek2 wrote: post #26
Swizec wrote: post #21

To me, the most surprising part is: Holy fuck, Audi's have huge petrol tanks! I usually fill up my reasonably priced car in like a minute or so and it gets a range of some 700 kilometers on a ~40 liter gas tank. 5 minutes for a petrol stop? That's insane.

Seemed normal to me. I think my wife's BMW SUV thingie fits like 90 liters.

Pssst, a BMW SUV is also a heavy luxury vehicle.

Re: Battery Swap [video]

#145

Post by JoeAltmaier »

calinet6 wrote: post #67
JoeAltmaier wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You've figured it wrong. After 37500 miles of long-distance driving, you have paid as much as a battery pack. Do you do less than that many long-distance miles in a normal car lifetime?

The point is that before this, charging (even with a supercharger in ~1 hour) was the accepted method of filling the battery, and it was free and/or cheap. That is still a perfectly acceptable method. Now you also have the choice of swapping, which provides you with a guarantee of a constantly healthy battery, a fast full charge, and continuous long-distance capability. I see your point—if you're doing 37,500 miles o…

Its not at all hard to drive 100 miles in a single trip every week. Visit your brother at the lake. Drive the spouse to a few events on the weekend. Even cruise the shoreline.

So that makes about 7 years (pessimistic) to pay as much as for a new battery pack.

Re: Battery Swap [video]

#146

Post by quackerhacker »

twism wrote: post #104
quackerhacker wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really hope that by 2030, we are utilizing Graphite Super capacitors....with everything I remember reading, it sounds like a miracle material.

I think wireless charging built into parking spots or even long stretches of highways (charging while driving) would be a lot cooler.

Does sound great, and reminds me alot about the predictions in Popular Mechanics.

Unfortunately, the greatest hindrance when it comes to great innovation and progress (that even Tesla is facing in other states) is politics.

However, I'm long on Tesla and I don't doubt Elon Musk for a second. He has electrical engineers (Tesla), computer technicians (Paypal...evident in Tesla's software), ..... and something that I can't believe is in his network.... rocket scientist (Space X...remember the saying "it's not rocket science," implies difficulty). To be as successful as he is, I'm sure he has political backing, it's just unfortunate that in politics, the basis is big bank takes little bank.

Re: Battery Swap [video]

#147

Post by danielweber »

CamperBob2 wrote: post #141
JPKab wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the business model needs to mimic that of the BetterPlace idea: Users of battery swapping stations pay a monthly fee, and the battery is seen more as a commodity which is rented by the user, but owned by the company. Coming back to get a battery is absurd, and should never happen.

Exactly. I've had this debate/argument many times with HN'ers. For some reason, people around here are unnaturally attached to the idea of owning a particular car battery. I've tried to see it from my interlocutors' point of view, but the point still isn't getting through to me, I'm afraid.

I agree. It strikes me as insane to swap out a ten-to-twenty thousand dollar piece of your car on any regular basis.

Re: Battery Swap [video]

#148

Post by andyjsong »

robomartin wrote: post #121

As an engineer I would have preferred to have seen a shot from under the car showing the actual process. It's unfortunate that they chose to record it from a hundred feet away. As for the reality of this swap deal. Well, it sounds like a logistical pain in the ass. You are required to come back and get your original battery pack back or pay the difference in cost for the new one. Option number two could be in the tho…

Here is a closer look: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CH-H3-F4Ztc

Looks like it's held on by 18-20 bolts.

Re: Battery Swap [video]

#149

Post by cdash »

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #145
calinet6 wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The point is that before this, charging (even with a supercharger in ~1 hour) was the accepted method of filling the battery, and it was free and/or cheap. That is still a perfectly acceptable method. Now you also have the choice of swapping, which provides you with a guarantee of a constantly healthy battery, a fast full charge, and continuous long-distance capability. I see your point—if you're doing 37,500 miles o…

Its not at all hard to drive 100 miles in a single trip every week. Visit your brother at the lake. Drive the spouse to a few events on the weekend. Even cruise the shoreline. So that makes about 7 years (pessimistic) to pay as much as for a new battery pack.

Why would you swap your battery in a 100 mile trip when the model s has much more range than 100 miles on a single charge.

Re: Battery Swap [video]

#150

Post by JoeAltmaier »

cdash wrote: post #149
JoeAltmaier wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Its not at all hard to drive 100 miles in a single trip every week. Visit your brother at the lake. Drive the spouse to a few events on the weekend. Even cruise the shoreline. So that makes about 7 years (pessimistic) to pay as much as for a new battery pack.

Why would you swap your battery in a 100 mile trip when the model s has much more range than 100 miles on a single charge.

Your new fully charged battery pack, yes. But they degrade. What are you getting from the station? Can you even tell? Pay $40 and end up with a half-capacity battery maybe.

So, use a bigger number than 100, it helps some, but not tremendously.

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