Am I the only one who finds the hero/traitor dichotomy that the New Yorker, CNN, etc. are advancing is unhelpful and perhaps disingenuous?
Why Edward Snowden Is a Hero
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Re: Why Edward Snowden Is a Hero
#22Sounds like a very nasty and clever way of publishing: One of 'em calls Snowden a traitor and then another calls him a hero. Two opposing stories, all for the eyeballs. I'd much prefer media to choose a side/ideology and then stick to it. New Yorker went in bed with snoopers earlier, so I don't see any reason to up-vote this story; even if the second author has written in favor of the people. Choice of the medium to…
Here's a quote from the article. It touches on the three subjects you mentioned: NSA, snooping, and `Orwellian`. """ Another Snowden leak, which Greenwald and the Guardian published over the weekend, was a set of documents concerning another secret N.S.A. tracking program with an Orwellian name: “Boundless Informant.” Apparently designed to keep Snowden’s former bosses abreast of what sorts of data it was collecting…
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Re: Why Edward Snowden Is a Hero
#23Regardless of his fate or the consequences of his revelations, he scarified his life for us. My respect for him is boundless. It's also a reminder of the vital and essential difference between fighting for liberty and Ayn Rand-ish "libertarianism", which is probably what many in government believe in.
I fail to see how you managed to make a connection to "Ayn Rand-ish libertarianism" and why you think many people in government believe in it. Don't libertarians dislike government?
Re: Why Edward Snowden Is a Hero
#24Regardless of his fate or the consequences of his revelations, he scarified his life for us. My respect for him is boundless. It's also a reminder of the vital and essential difference between fighting for liberty and Ayn Rand-ish "libertarianism", which is probably what many in government believe in.
I fail to see how you managed to make a connection to "Ayn Rand-ish libertarianism" and why you think many people in government believe in it. Don't libertarians dislike government?
Libertarians (unlike anarchists) don't "dislike government." They dislike government that has more than a specific set of responsibilities.
That said, I don't get the Rand connection here either. I will say that NSA spying isn't necessarily incompatible with a libertarian government. Libertarians don't reject the law & order or security functions of the state. Even a libertarian government would have the power to issue warrants, subpoenas, etc. Given that, something like the recent NSA incident couldn't have been prevented with a "small libertarian government." It's cheap as hell (Google, etc, do all the work!) and leverages basic powers that would exist in the "smallest" governments.
Re: Why Edward Snowden Is a Hero
#25Earlier quoted context omitted.
"I tell you, freedom and human rights in America are doomed. The U.S. government will lead the American people in -- and the West in general -- into an unbearable hell and a choking life." - Osama bin Laden, October 2001 http://archives.cnn.com/2002/US/01/31/gen.binladen.interview...
When a hardcore terrorist calls the future correctly you have a huge problem
I'm suggesting that it was a planned outcome (of terrorism) to make our governments to mistrust us like this.
Bin Laden wasn't the first person to predict that an increase in terrorism would lead to an increase in "Orwellian" practices.
Re: Why Edward Snowden Is a Hero
#26Earlier quoted context omitted.
"I tell you, freedom and human rights in America are doomed. The U.S. government will lead the American people in -- and the West in general -- into an unbearable hell and a choking life." - Osama bin Laden, October 2001 http://archives.cnn.com/2002/US/01/31/gen.binladen.interview...
When a hardcore terrorist calls the future correctly you have a huge problem
Takes one to know one.
Re: Why Edward Snowden Is a Hero
#27Earlier quoted context omitted.
One can have little doubt that the real terrorists look upon all this with glee. I imagine the perpetrators of extremist based terrorism see this erosion of civil liberties as an enormous win. Yes. Snowden is definitely a hero, of dare I say it, historic proportions.
"I tell you, freedom and human rights in America are doomed. The U.S. government will lead the American people in -- and the West in general -- into an unbearable hell and a choking life." - Osama bin Laden, October 2001 http://archives.cnn.com/2002/US/01/31/gen.binladen.interview...
There's a difference between telling the future and saying things that happen to turn out correct. That sentence has no information content beyond disliking the US. (And in general quoting Bin Laden as ambassador for human rights may also not be a very good idea.)
Re: Why Edward Snowden Is a Hero
#28Regardless of his fate or the consequences of his revelations, he scarified his life for us. My respect for him is boundless. It's also a reminder of the vital and essential difference between fighting for liberty and Ayn Rand-ish "libertarianism", which is probably what many in government believe in.
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Re: Why Edward Snowden Is a Hero
#29Regardless of his fate or the consequences of his revelations, he scarified his life for us. My respect for him is boundless. It's also a reminder of the vital and essential difference between fighting for liberty and Ayn Rand-ish "libertarianism", which is probably what many in government believe in.
I assume from your comment you never read Atlas Shrugged. If anything it calls out the issues we are seeing today in the NSA and especially the IRS. The threat of, if not use of, government power to regulate, dictate, and confiscate. The intimidation of people and thoughts not acceptable to those in power.
Her books are about personal freedom. Whether the freedom she espoused is too much for some people is another question
Re: Why Edward Snowden Is a Hero
#30I have to agree that in his actions the public benefit by far outwieghs the "security" risk. In a country where people have been blocked from travelling for mentioning "bomb" and "airport" in the same tweet it's not really shocking that the security apparatus is monitoring the internet. Like he mentioned there's a reason Osama's home had no internet or phone connection. So this leak only does one thing, show the exte…
One can have little doubt that the real terrorists look upon all this with glee. I imagine the perpetrators of extremist based terrorism see this erosion of civil liberties as an enormous win. Yes. Snowden is definitely a hero, of dare I say it, historic proportions.
Will he still be a hero of historic proportions if it turns out he misconstrued the four power point slides?