Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Why Edward Snowden Is a Hero

newyorker.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

11–20 of 43 posts

Re: Why Edward Snowden Is a Hero

#11

Post by monsterix »

danboarder wrote: post #10
monsterix wrote: post #3

Sounds like a very nasty and clever way of publishing: One of 'em calls Snowden a traitor and then another calls him a hero. Two opposing stories, all for the eyeballs. I'd much prefer media to choose a side/ideology and then stick to it. New Yorker went in bed with snoopers earlier, so I don't see any reason to up-vote this story; even if the second author has written in favor of the people. Choice of the medium to…

@monsterix I think you stopped reading too soon. A few paragraphs in the major focus of this article indeed takes Snowden's side and sticks to it, addressing exactly the real issues (not 'steering away' from them as you claim). This article goes further than others with links to sources of intelligence agencies denying these programs on record (basically "lying" to congress), see http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/video…

I do agree that the article itself is among the better written stories about NSA and snoops. The title of the post on HN, however, needs editing (tries to sway attention from NSA/snooping to the messenger).

Re: Why Edward Snowden Is a Hero

#12

Post by Amadou »

ra wrote: post #9
cdooh wrote: post #7

I have to agree that in his actions the public benefit by far outwieghs the "security" risk. In a country where people have been blocked from travelling for mentioning "bomb" and "airport" in the same tweet it's not really shocking that the security apparatus is monitoring the internet. Like he mentioned there's a reason Osama's home had no internet or phone connection. So this leak only does one thing, show the exte…

One can have little doubt that the real terrorists look upon all this with glee. I imagine the perpetrators of extremist based terrorism see this erosion of civil liberties as an enormous win. Yes. Snowden is definitely a hero, of dare I say it, historic proportions.

"I tell you, freedom and human rights in America are doomed. The U.S. government will lead the American people in -- and the West in general -- into an unbearable hell and a choking life." - Osama bin Laden, October 2001 http://archives.cnn.com/2002/US/01/31/gen.binladen.interview...

Re: Why Edward Snowden Is a Hero

#13

Post by regal »

prospero wrote: post #5
monsterix wrote: post #3

Sounds like a very nasty and clever way of publishing: One of 'em calls Snowden a traitor and then another calls him a hero. Two opposing stories, all for the eyeballs. I'd much prefer media to choose a side/ideology and then stick to it. New Yorker went in bed with snoopers earlier, so I don't see any reason to up-vote this story; even if the second author has written in favor of the people. Choice of the medium to…

The majority of of the article discusses the latest information about the NSA, and how we should hold NSA officials responsible for repeatedly lying to congress. Did you even bother to read it?

monsterix is talking about the third sentence in the article, which links to another article on the same website with the opposing view point.

Its title is "Edward Snowden is No Hero," and it contains sentiments like, "He is, rather, a grandiose narcissist who deserves to be in prison," and, "As a result, all of Snowden’s secrets may wind up in the hands of the Chinese government—which has no commitment at all to free speech or the right to political dissent. And that makes Snowden a hero?"

Did you bother to read it?

Re: Why Edward Snowden Is a Hero

#14

Post by meritt »

Stop focusing on Snowden, hero or traitor, he's probably fake. The revelation is important, not the messenger.

The idea of "Snowden" is critically important -- citizens standing up against government overreach -- but him as an individual is immaterial.

Re: Why Edward Snowden Is a Hero

#15

Post by jacquesm »

meritt wrote: post #14

Stop focusing on Snowden, hero or traitor, he's probably fake. The revelation is important, not the messenger. The idea of "Snowden" is critically important -- citizens standing up against government overreach -- but him as an individual is immaterial.

Fake?

Re: Why Edward Snowden Is a Hero

#16

Post by danboarder »

regal wrote: post #13
prospero wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The majority of of the article discusses the latest information about the NSA, and how we should hold NSA officials responsible for repeatedly lying to congress. Did you even bother to read it?

monsterix is talking about the third sentence in the article, which links to another article on the same website with the opposing view point. Its title is "Edward Snowden is No Hero," and it contains sentiments like, "He is, rather, a grandiose narcissist who deserves to be in prison," and, "As a result, all of Snowden’s secrets may wind up in the hands of the Chinese government—which has no commitment at all to fre…

Except that's a critique of the publication rather than pertaining to the content of the article itself, which I don't think is a fair reason to flag a posted article. Posted articles should be evaluated on their own merits.

To address monstrix point though, I don't agree that each publication should be expected to take one side. It really depends on the type of publication and their chosen structure; some publish for the "left" or the "right", while others are willing to publish articles from authors with differing political views. The New Yorker (which I happen to subscribe to) is the latter type of publication - they publish a variety of authors who argue their own viewpoints, generally a great selection of fiction, poetry, and non-fiction.

One additional thought: I think it's a good thinking tool to read well-written opposing views to get inside the mind of one's rhetorical opponent in order to understand an issue from multiple viewpoints when forming opinions and arguments.

Re: Why Edward Snowden Is a Hero

#17

Post by cafard »

ra wrote: post #9
cdooh wrote: post #7

I have to agree that in his actions the public benefit by far outwieghs the "security" risk. In a country where people have been blocked from travelling for mentioning "bomb" and "airport" in the same tweet it's not really shocking that the security apparatus is monitoring the internet. Like he mentioned there's a reason Osama's home had no internet or phone connection. So this leak only does one thing, show the exte…

One can have little doubt that the real terrorists look upon all this with glee. I imagine the perpetrators of extremist based terrorism see this erosion of civil liberties as an enormous win. Yes. Snowden is definitely a hero, of dare I say it, historic proportions.

I have plenty of doubt.

It might be worth an ironic smirk to real terrorists, but Al Quaeda etc. are surely not out to reduce our civil liberties but to establish governments to their own liking, primarily in certain definite regions. The revelations may teach them something about the reach of US intelligence, but they'd have been foolish not to assume something like this was going on.

Re: Why Edward Snowden Is a Hero

#18

Post by cdooh »

Amadou wrote: post #12
ra wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One can have little doubt that the real terrorists look upon all this with glee. I imagine the perpetrators of extremist based terrorism see this erosion of civil liberties as an enormous win. Yes. Snowden is definitely a hero, of dare I say it, historic proportions.

"I tell you, freedom and human rights in America are doomed. The U.S. government will lead the American people in -- and the West in general -- into an unbearable hell and a choking life." - Osama bin Laden, October 2001 http://archives.cnn.com/2002/US/01/31/gen.binladen.interview...

When a hardcore terrorist calls the future correctly you have a huge problem

Re: Why Edward Snowden Is a Hero

#19

Post by nsns »

Regardless of his fate or the consequences of his revelations, he scarified his life for us. My respect for him is boundless.

It's also a reminder of the vital and essential difference between fighting for liberty and Ayn Rand-ish "libertarianism", which is probably what many in government believe in.

Re: Why Edward Snowden Is a Hero

#20

Post by olalonde »

nsns wrote: post #19

Regardless of his fate or the consequences of his revelations, he scarified his life for us. My respect for him is boundless. It's also a reminder of the vital and essential difference between fighting for liberty and Ayn Rand-ish "libertarianism", which is probably what many in government believe in.

I fail to see how you managed to make a connection to "Ayn Rand-ish libertarianism" and why you think many people in government believe in it. Don't libertarians dislike government?
Post reply on HN