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Hong Kong Baffled by Snowden’s Hideout

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Re: Hong Kong Baffled by Snowden’s Hideout

#51

Post by resu_nimda »

macspoofing wrote: post #39

Here's a cynical interpretation: Hong Kong makes zero sense given that they are a) within Chinese sphere of influence and b) frequently extradites to the US. He's go other sensitive documents he may sell to the Chinese in exchange for money and sanctuary. So maybe that was the plan all along. Everyone focuses on the NSA wire-tapping scandal (which, honestly, I think everyone assumed was happening for years), and he g…

I don't think it makes sense. Like he said in his interview, he could have just sold the stuff he already leaked. Why then would he bother with the whole trouble of very publicly becoming America's Most Wanted? He sounded pretty sincere about doing this for the good of the American people. He claims he made a concerted effort to not reveal any information that could harm individuals, which appears to hold up.

I would think (hope) he has some cards up his sleeve to protect himself, but at this point I think all the double-agent/working with China talk is wild conjecture.

Re: Hong Kong Baffled by Snowden’s Hideout

#52

Post by rayiner »

grandalf wrote: post #36

China would turn Snowden over to US authorities only in exchange for the return of Chinese protesters given asylum in the US. The "China is an oppressive regime" meme makes up a lot of US propaganda and is used to justify all kinds of policies. So the US is put in the awkward position of not being able to engage in the usual diplomatic trade. Hong Kong is useful b/c it represents the future of Chinese society and is…

> The "China is an oppressive regime" meme

It's not a meme. It's fact.

Re: Hong Kong Baffled by Snowden’s Hideout

#53

Post by 286c8cb04bda »

rayiner wrote: post #52
grandalf wrote: post #36

China would turn Snowden over to US authorities only in exchange for the return of Chinese protesters given asylum in the US. The "China is an oppressive regime" meme makes up a lot of US propaganda and is used to justify all kinds of policies. So the US is put in the awkward position of not being able to engage in the usual diplomatic trade. Hong Kong is useful b/c it represents the future of Chinese society and is…

> The "China is an oppressive regime" meme It's not a meme. It's fact.

> It's not a meme. It's fact.

Those are not mutually exclusive.

Re: Hong Kong Baffled by Snowden’s Hideout

#55

Post by pyre »

rayiner wrote: post #50

> According to an interview with The Guardian, 29-year-old Edward Snowden, whose revelations have created a political uproar, has stashed himself in an unidentified luxury hotel in Hong Kong, a city he said he chose as the best place to hunker down given its “spirited commitment to free speech and the right of political dissent.” You mean the place that has no political freedom to speak of and exists under the PRC's…

HK has more political freedom than the rest of the PRC. I've heard of protests there that would be illegal anywhere else in the PRC. IIRC, you also need special travel papers to go to HK from the rest of the PRC.

Re: Hong Kong Baffled by Snowden’s Hideout

#57

Post by EmmEnnEff »

9999 wrote: post #30
junto wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He earned $200,000 a year. Maybe he has some savings.

200,000 does not seem excessive given the difficulty of finding someone who is both technically competent and trustworthy.. Oh wait...

I think what they are looking for are people that are technically competent, and entirely lacking in a consciousness.

Re: Hong Kong Baffled by Snowden’s Hideout

#58

Post by IAmAI343 »

randall wrote: post #42
oinksoft wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Brilliant. It's sad it lends itself so easily to spin, "The Chinese Turned Him!" I expect that is what Americans will be told to believe.

But i mean it's curious he did this right as the Chinese PM was visiting Obama, no?

No is not. To you maybe, but not to me. It just looks like a coincidence and that is like I will take it until further evidence emerges. Otherwise we just look like the religious morons whom claim that their religious text is the correct one because it predicted a historical event somewhere in the last two thousand years.

Re: Hong Kong Baffled by Snowden’s Hideout

#59

Post by cloudwizard »

rayiner wrote: post #52
grandalf wrote: post #36

China would turn Snowden over to US authorities only in exchange for the return of Chinese protesters given asylum in the US. The "China is an oppressive regime" meme makes up a lot of US propaganda and is used to justify all kinds of policies. So the US is put in the awkward position of not being able to engage in the usual diplomatic trade. Hong Kong is useful b/c it represents the future of Chinese society and is…

> The "China is an oppressive regime" meme It's not a meme. It's fact.

This brings up the idea that Snowden fled the US to a place that he felt would be more free.

Re: Hong Kong Baffled by Snowden’s Hideout

#60

Post by einhverfr »

oinksoft wrote: post #28
uvdiv wrote: post #17

This is contradicted somewhat by a different source. This one says Hong Kong is a very good place to seek asylum right now, because there is a moratorium on deporting asylum-seekers: But there is at least one reason it could be incredibly shrewd: Hong Kong's asylum system is currently stuck in a state of limbo that could allow Snowden to exploit a loophole and buy some valuable time. Simon Young, director of the Cent…

Brilliant. It's sad it lends itself so easily to spin, "The Chinese Turned Him!" I expect that is what Americans will be told to believe.

But on top of that you have the fact that "The Chinese could offer him asylum in exchange for classified information" is a decent deterrent for them even asking.

Additionally, suppose they ask China for extradition and China offers protection in exchange for information. Then Snowden has several useful options. He could suggest that the US back off so he doesn't have to make a decision. He could give in to the Chinese. He could turn himself in and issue a public statement that if the only way he could stay in Hongkong was to sell out his country he would rather face jail.

Even the third option (turning himself in) would be very possibly something that would work in his defence. That is hard to spin against him, "He's so patriotic he'd rather go to jail than sell out his country."

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