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The dying platform: .Net

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Re: The dying platform: .Net

#21

Post by archon »

peterevans wrote: post #14
dia80 wrote: post #5

I'm apt to agree. I have used .net before in a large desktop app and it was brilliant but I'm sure I will never use it again - deskwhat? Only thing I can think of that might save the day is if MS properly open sourced it. Chances of that have to be pretty much identically zero though.

They'd need more than to open source it, I think. For .NET to make it, they would need some kind of killer app -- something that makes people use .NET despite whatever natural inclinations they may have. I don't see that happening. I mean, ten years ago, did you think lots of people would be coding in Objective C? It's funny how things change.

> For .NET to make it, they would need some kind of killer app -- something that makes people use .NET despite whatever natural inclinations they may have. I don't see that happening.

By "people" do you mean developers or end users? Because if you mean end users, every end user of Windows uses some program that's built in .Net every day. End users don't care, as long as it works.

If you mean developers, developers go where the people are, for better or worse. There are a lot of people using i-devices, so Objective C lives and will continue to live. There are a lot of people and companies using Windows machines, so .Net lives and will continue to live.

Re: The dying platform: .Net

#22

Post by alanbyrne »

MichaelAza wrote: post #7

.NET, like practically all tolls by Microsoft, is good for one thing - Large scale enterprise development for Windows. It plays well with Office, Access, Sharepoint, Active Directory, IIS etc. and it's the best around at what it's doing. You can also do webdev or solve highly concurrent problems with .NET and it's great at that as well (I'm very fond of the Nancy framework and C#'s async/await are a godsend) but it's…

I agree. I've recently noticed a huge amount of .Net resources for the Microsoft Cloud based on Azure, Office 365, SharePoint Online etc. I expect there'll be lots of money made piggy backing LOB .Net applications off these services.

Re: The dying platform: .Net

#23

Post by MichaelAza »

rubinelli wrote: post #16

Java isn't looking too good, either, at least in the desktop. You know your platform has jumped the shark when it comes bundled with a toolbar. The question is, where to next? I've been watching Go for a while, but it looks like a tool from Googlers, for Googlers. Pulling all my dependencies from HEAD? No, thank you. Ironically, Javascript looks very promising right now, compared with the alternatives.

What killed go for me, except for the unplesant "mangled c" syntax, was the importing. When I read about that remote import nonesense I laughed a bit and marked it off.

Re: The dying platform: .Net

#24

Post by MatthewPhillips »

.NET has a long life ahead of itself in the enterprise, where companies on "the Microsoft stack" typically won't even use 3rd party libraries where there is a Microsoft sanctioned alternative. Until Microsoft comes out with a replacement for things like Windows services and web application development, .NET will be around.

I don't see there being an alternative even on the horizon. Presumably they could create a Node.js type of platform backed by Chakra but there aren't any signs that they are even working on such a thing.

(Also, throwing out .NET would mean throwing out F# which gives them a lot of cred in certain circles).

Re: The dying platform: .Net

#25

Post by patrickaljord »

gregd wrote: post #17

One of the things that I've often thought MS could do to attract more developers to this platform, is to release the brilliant piece of software that is Visual Studio, for FREE. Not just the "Express" edition...the full blown "Ultimate" edition. They should also buy Red Gate and Jet Brains and bake their products into VS and SSMS themselves, while happily releasing updates and enhancements for FREE. Bah...what do I k…

The problem is Microsoft is into the business of selling software licenses to make their billions. They don't have a billion dollar hardware business like Apple or a billion dollar ad business like Google that allows them to license their software for free/cheap. So if MS start licensing their software for free, they would stop making money (they do have the xbox and a few services but they're not enoough).

Re: The dying platform: .Net

#26

Post by cypher543 »

rubinelli wrote: post #16

Java isn't looking too good, either, at least in the desktop. You know your platform has jumped the shark when it comes bundled with a toolbar. The question is, where to next? I've been watching Go for a while, but it looks like a tool from Googlers, for Googlers. Pulling all my dependencies from HEAD? No, thank you. Ironically, Javascript looks very promising right now, compared with the alternatives.

I find it strange that people are hung up on this remote dependency "issue." It's a convenience for small projects and quick samples. There is absolutely nothing stopping you from checking out a Go package locally and importing it just like any other dependency in any other language.

Re: The dying platform: .Net

#27

Post by gregd »

potatolicious wrote: post #12
cl8ton wrote: post #3

From what perspective are you coming from that you think .NET is dying (student, education, corporate, open source)? MS has never been a technology leader as they tend to let others make the early mistakes then charge in, ask Netware, OS2/IBM, Sony, Netscape. Early bird gets the worm but the second mouse gets the cheese!

All of the above? A little background: some of my earliest bits of programming were on VB5, then VB6, and then .NET 1.0 when that first showed up. I spent most of my early years on MS platforms, and for the most part I liked them. I picked up a Surface RT to hack on last year, after a long absence from .NET. The state of .NET shocked me. For one thing, the subset of .NET that's available on WinRT vs. "real" Win8 vs.…

A more general complaint is MS's schizophrenic support of .NET.

But, but, but, Silverlight.

Re: The dying platform: .Net

#28

Post by toyg »

gregd wrote: post #17

One of the things that I've often thought MS could do to attract more developers to this platform, is to release the brilliant piece of software that is Visual Studio, for FREE. Not just the "Express" edition...the full blown "Ultimate" edition. They should also buy Red Gate and Jet Brains and bake their products into VS and SSMS themselves, while happily releasing updates and enhancements for FREE. Bah...what do I k…

I don't know any recent numbers, but it used to be that VS and Windows were symbiotic profit centres, helping each other to generate profits, so I can see the reluctance in going all-free-all-the-time for one of them at the same time as the other is seriously at risk.

Re: The dying platform: .Net

#29

Post by cl8ton »

potatolicious wrote: post #12
cl8ton wrote: post #3

From what perspective are you coming from that you think .NET is dying (student, education, corporate, open source)? MS has never been a technology leader as they tend to let others make the early mistakes then charge in, ask Netware, OS2/IBM, Sony, Netscape. Early bird gets the worm but the second mouse gets the cheese!

All of the above? A little background: some of my earliest bits of programming were on VB5, then VB6, and then .NET 1.0 when that first showed up. I spent most of my early years on MS platforms, and for the most part I liked them. I picked up a Surface RT to hack on last year, after a long absence from .NET. The state of .NET shocked me. For one thing, the subset of .NET that's available on WinRT vs. "real" Win8 vs.…

Some of the things MS pulled the plug on needed it. I can’t vouch for WinRT development but the .NET 4.5 is rock solid and predictable for WinPhone & Win7/8 from my desk. Have you used NuGet yet with over 1100 packages?

Microsoft is a public company that makes software and sells it for a profit, what is wrong with this business model?

All the free open source software you use to make a product, do you then give your product away?

Re: The dying platform: .Net

#30

Post by ramayac »

rubinelli wrote: post #16

Java isn't looking too good, either, at least in the desktop. You know your platform has jumped the shark when it comes bundled with a toolbar. The question is, where to next? I've been watching Go for a while, but it looks like a tool from Googlers, for Googlers. Pulling all my dependencies from HEAD? No, thank you. Ironically, Javascript looks very promising right now, compared with the alternatives.

"You know your platform has jumped the shark when it comes bundled with a toolbar.", that was such a sad episode. Oh well, while the Android ecosystem doesn't make a switch, I guess I'll keep using it.
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