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Iron Ring

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Re: Iron Ring

#131

Post by amackera »

So strange to see this popping up on Hacker News. I always thought of it as a sort of obscure Canadian tradition (even many people within Canada have no idea what my ring represents, and ask me about it occasionally).

The ring is a great tradition, it brings engineers together with a sense of obligation and identity; however, in the effort of full disclosure, non-Canadian HNers should be aware that some people decide not to be ringed on ethical grounds, citing possible sexist and elitist connotations in the traditional and the ritual itself.

Re: Iron Ring

#132

Post by format »

TheCapn wrote: post #91
joegaudet wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We make the world go round is exactly what the ring is _not_ about. For one, software developers /engineers would be nothing without the computer engineers building the systems the software runs on, and the computer engineers would be nothing without the electrical engineers and device physicists who develop the electrical components from which computers are built... and on and on it goes (turtles the whole way down)…

>- To put monetary compensation second to doing quality work (the reason the ring is worn on the pinky finger far away from your gold wedding band - which it will destroy) Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't this incorrect? The ring is to be worn on your dominant hand as to have it rub against the engineering drawings you create/stamp in a more traditional sense of the engineering discipline (before computer aided desi…

We were instructed that the ring was to be worn on the dominant hand so that it could rub on the page while writing or drafting and serve as a reminder of our obligation. We were also told that the beveled design and iron metal was meant to cut into and destroy gold rings.

There wasn't ever any talk of left-handed married engineers, I assumed that this edge case was not thought of by Mr. Kipling.

Re: Iron Ring

#133

Post by swalberg »

TheCapn wrote: post #91
joegaudet wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We make the world go round is exactly what the ring is _not_ about. For one, software developers /engineers would be nothing without the computer engineers building the systems the software runs on, and the computer engineers would be nothing without the electrical engineers and device physicists who develop the electrical components from which computers are built... and on and on it goes (turtles the whole way down)…

>- To put monetary compensation second to doing quality work (the reason the ring is worn on the pinky finger far away from your gold wedding band - which it will destroy) Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't this incorrect? The ring is to be worn on your dominant hand as to have it rub against the engineering drawings you create/stamp in a more traditional sense of the engineering discipline (before computer aided desi…

If I remember the ceremony correctly ('98) it was to be worn on the pinky finger of the working hand to serve as a reminder that like our work, steel is cold and unforgiving.

It's the code of ethics that put our priorities as society, our profession, our employer, and ourselves.

Re: Iron Ring

#134

Post by format »

AYBABTME wrote: post #125
TheCapn wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Canadian Engineering Accreditation Board is the authoritative body as far as I'm aware and in order to title yourself an "Engineer" you need to be a member of your provincial regulatory body since the title "Engineer" is a protected title under law. It isn't really enforced in any way but to call yourself a "Software Engineer" without having P.Eng. in Canada is technically illegal. EDIT: Its pointed out in a differen…

Software Engineers in Canada can be P.Eng if they choose to. What makes you think she/he's not?

There are very many "Software Engineers" that are not actually Engineers though and many job postings looking for a Software Engineer don't actually care if you actually went to an Engineering school. I think that is what that person meant.

Re: Iron Ring

#135

Post by format »

Zombieball wrote: post #129
AYBABTME wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Software Engineers in Canada can be P.Eng if they choose to. What makes you think she/he's not?

This is correct. I graduated from UBC as a Software Engineer and have applied as an EIT with APEGBC. I haven't followed through to apply for P. Eng. status though as the process is a little more difficult for software folks. You are supposed to submit work experience under supervision of another P. Eng. which are not very common place in our industry. I believe you can apply for exceptions to this rule though. I pers…

I suppose I am lucky, my immediate supervisors are both P.Eng because of the nature of what we do. I agree though, I don't think it matters much in the software field. I don't have the required amount of work experience yet, but as a Computer Engineer working in and interested in the software field I am on the fence.

Re: Iron Ring

#136

Post by format »

HorizonXP wrote: post #72

My Iron Ring has been a conversation starter wherever I travel, and I've only had it for 5 years. Any time I'm in the Valley, people recognize the ring and ask if I went to Waterloo. Funny thing is that I did, but I usually try to explain to them that all Canadian engineering graduates wear it, not just Waterloo. I was even in Italy with my then-girlfriend-now-fiancee, and I had someone strike up a conversation with…

I was at the grocery store and the cashier motioned to my hand and showed me her ring and we had a short discussion. I felt happy that I had this bond with a person I had never met and then immediately very sad that she was working as a cashier in a grocery store.

Re: Iron Ring

#137

Post by protomyth »

JimmaDaRustla wrote: post #68

They need something like this for auto mechanics - they don't feel obligated for any responsibility...

You deal with the wrong auto mechanics. The local one replaced a plastic part in the door with one he cut out of aluminum and charged 1/4th the cost of a replacement plastic one.

Re: Iron Ring

#138

Post by recursive »

hcarvalhoalves wrote: post #104
npsimons wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In all fairness, there has never been anything quite like "architecting" software, or "engineering" software. As Brooks put it, software is the most complex thing humans have ever built; perhaps we should find some other term that sets us apart from ordinary engineers and architects. Or we could just continue working, not caring what other people think. That's usually what I do, after I tell people I'm a "code monkey…

> As Brooks put it, software is the most complex thing humans have ever built; perhaps we should find some other term that sets us apart from ordinary engineers and architects. Developer.

Developing is what you do to real estate.

Re: Iron Ring

#140

Post by ISL »

koenigdavidmj wrote: post #67
sergiotapia wrote: post #34

Is there something like this for Software developers? We make the world go round and round; shouldn't we also have something this beautiful?

For most of us, people don't die when we fuck up.

To waste someone's time is to deprive them of a little bit of life.
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