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Gitmo Is Killing Me

nytimes.com

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Re: Gitmo Is Killing Me

#221

Post by nemof »

rmc wrote: post #146
davedx wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But those other countries do not claim moral high ground in the same way the US does on so many other issues, or claim to lead the world with respect to values such as freedom and democracy (of which the right to a fair trial can be considered a part).

Yes they do. All countries claim to be the best.

in a post imperialist, post empire Europe we've grown beyond needing to swing our dicks around in a pissing contest. Some countries more than others it's true, but generally speaking there are better things to do than spend our time claiming our particular demesne in superior to all others.

Re: Gitmo Is Killing Me

#222

Post by ericd »

vxNsr wrote: post #205
sgpl wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

TL:DR: This dude was at the wrong place at the wrong time; and unless the US Government can prove otherwise, they should either release him, or if he is a terrorist, it would be a net-win if they just let him die of hunger (As their reputation w.r.t Gitmo has already been sullied). -- In a parallel universe, I claim that you are committing conspiracy to overthrow the reigning King. You say you were just walking by th…

Cute story but unless you know something I don't about his case which you're not sharing then it's just that... a cute story. If that's what happened well it sucks to be him but technically under the Geneva Convention and current laws of war, the US is allowed to hold him until the war ends at which point it must try him before a court (which can be a military tribunal) or trade him for it's own soldiers who are bein…

Who are you to say what's acceptable for someone else to do with their life? He probably doesn't adhere to the same principles you do (judging by your comments, most people probably don't). Also, it clearly says held since 2002, so not less than 10 years.

Re: Gitmo Is Killing Me

#223

Post by rmc »

hobolobo wrote: post #203
rmc wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, and some countries had their own Gitmos. The UK had hunger strikes and imprisonment without trial during their own civil war in Northern Ireland. It's not as black and white as "USA bad, EU good".

Whilst internment was a pretty nasty thing, I don't think that what went on in British prisons is comparable to what goes on in Guatanamo Bay. The point was that whilst nowhere is perfectly just and or free, there is the perception that the USA promotes itself as being so.

The British didn't do forced feeding, but I'd hardly say it was great. As well as hunger strikes the prisoners also protested wearing prison uniforms. So the staff didn't empty their toilets. The prisoners smeared their feces on the walls. I'd recommend the film Hunger, it's a bit raw.

Re: Gitmo Is Killing Me

#225

Post by rmc »

Nursie wrote: post #174
rmc wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

$MY_COUNTRY Exceptionalism

I don't know of another country that has it quite so bad. I know of nowhere else in the western world where people fly flags or drape themselves in the flag with anything like the regularity of the US. It really sticks out compared to everywhere else I've been, and I've travelled to/in 30+ countries now.

Oh yeah the USAians really seem to go for flags. In most of Europe, only right wing nationalists and sports fans wave flags.

Re: Gitmo Is Killing Me

#226

Post by spot »

Locke1689 wrote: post #34
SoftwareMaven wrote: post #17

Gitmo was the first thing that clued me that I had made a mistake voting for Obama's promises (not that McCain would have ever gotten it instead!). It was such a complete reversal that I immediately knew his promises were completely worthless. I appreciate that there may be anger outs people in Gitmo, but they have every right to a trial I have. The double standard of what human rights mean if you are a US citizen an…

The problem is that to close Guantanamo, you need funding to a least move the prisoners to another facility. Introducing them to the justice system would require the same. As every American should know, Congress holds the purse strings here and has denied said request. The President has no power here.

Long before, and fully independent of, anything Congress did, President Obama made clear that he was going to preserve the indefinite detention system at Guantanamo even once he closed the camp.

http://www.salon.com/2012/07/23/the_obama_gitmo_myth/

Re: Gitmo Is Killing Me

#227

Post by [deleted] »

atsaloli wrote: post #43
pixelcort wrote: post #8

With this story of Guantanamo Bay and the story of children born into prison camps in North Korea, as a mere software engineer, it makes me feel hopeless as to how to help.

If you're in the US, pixelcort, may I invite you to consider the Downsize DC effort? ( http://www.downsizedc.org/ ) Here is a quick summary of what DownsizeDC.org is about: We believe the federal government has grown too centralized, too intrusive, and too expensive. We believe in constitutional limits, smaller government, civil liberties, federalism, and low taxes. We want to end laws and programs that don't work, c…

[deleted]

Re: Gitmo Is Killing Me

#228

Post by delinka »

davidw wrote: post #210
serf wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the article, or the opinion espoused by the commenter you replied to? In other words, you come to HN for one aspect of the Political world , and not all of them? Myself, I don't come to HN for ANYTHING in this thread. It's all interesting, in it's own right, but has little to do with 'hacking'. But, then again, civil liberties are a set of issues that can broadly affect us all.. maybe that was the grand position of w…

> But, then again, civil liberties are a set of issues that can broadly affect us all If HN's front page were open to anything and everything, and links were voted for based on their importance in the real world, the actual Hacker News content would be completely buried. The real world is far more important than most of what's on Hacker News, so paradoxically, if we want to maintain the quality and focus of HN, real…

The entire process of "approving" articles is democratic. The community of users decides what is interesting enough to appear on the front page. If you personally disagree that a particular article should be on the front page, well ... your only recourse is to flag it. If a democratic site is not what you want, then you don't want HN.

Re: Gitmo Is Killing Me

#229

Post by davidw »

delinka wrote: post #228
davidw wrote: post #210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But, then again, civil liberties are a set of issues that can broadly affect us all If HN's front page were open to anything and everything, and links were voted for based on their importance in the real world, the actual Hacker News content would be completely buried. The real world is far more important than most of what's on Hacker News, so paradoxically, if we want to maintain the quality and focus of HN, real…

The entire process of "approving" articles is democratic. The community of users decides what is interesting enough to appear on the front page. If you personally disagree that a particular article should be on the front page, well ... your only recourse is to flag it. If a democratic site is not what you want, then you don't want HN.

Actually, there are moderators who can and do kill stories, more or less according to the guidelines ( http://ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html ). If a completely democratic site is what you want, you want reddit.

Re: Gitmo Is Killing Me

#230

Post by tomp »

facorreia wrote: post #178
hmottestad wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On days like these the US is Guantanamo Bay. The US is poverty and regular people without a home. The US is bad health care, as in only the rich can afford it. The US is drones, fired at civilians in the dead of night. The US is oil, as in that they want it all. The US is guns, like the ones likely to be pointed at you if you get robbed. The US is x-rays at the airport. And finally, the US is the land of the free.

This is not the kind of content I come to Hacker News for.

I didn't downvote you because I didn't agree with you (even though I don't), but because your comment is underspecified, un-argumented, and thus without any value.
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