Diamonds Are Bullshit • Hacker News Board

Re: Diamonds Are Bullshit

#471

Post by jaggederest » Wed, Mar 20, 2013, 7:23 AM UTC

charlieflowers wrote: post #291

bradleyland wrote: post #279

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The psychology of diamonds only works if you pay a lot for the stone. I would posit that synthetic diamonds fail for the same reasons that knock-offs like cubic zirconiums fail. They don't deliver on the promise of the advertising. The advertising promises that your love can only be shown by spending a lot of money on this specific thing with these specific set of arbitrary selected attributes. E.g., it must come fro…

It's like believing in the Tooth Fairy or the Easter Bunny, but for adults. What other manufactured fairy tales have huge quantities of humans swallowed hook line and sinker?

Wine. Wine prices are based mostly on arbitrary criteria, not on actual quality.

If you blind taste test wines, it looks like there's nearly no correlation between price and quality above $5-$10 a bottle.

Re: Diamonds Are Bullshit

#472

Post by kamaal » Wed, Mar 20, 2013, 7:24 AM UTC

omegant wrote: post #420

jenius wrote: post #357

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You absolutely nailed it with this comment. Was reading pieces of the debate out loud to my girlfriend, who is rather rational and intelligent but for some reason still wants a diamond ring (and I couldn't really figure out why) - when I read this and looked over, I knew you got it 100% right. Well done.

Then buy used (the diamond) and pay for a nice ring design. But don't tell her.

..And then deal with the crap storm that would erupt when she discovers about it..

Re: Diamonds Are Bullshit

#473

Post by lostlogin » Wed, Mar 20, 2013, 7:26 AM UTC

rayiner wrote: post #296

YZF wrote: post #273

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My wife really enjoyed the experience. We had a home birth. No epidural. Two kids. It is a life changing experience for both wife and husband. It's part of life. Life isn't a video game. It's not a synthetic experience. Some people may prefer to be a brain in a jar hooked to some wires but then where would they put the diamond ring? :-)

My wife is a zealot in the anti home birth holy war so I'm going to just express my happiness that yours found it enjoyable and slowly walk away from the keyboard.

yeah, usually there are provoking stories on both side. I work in a radiology department that has a strong obstetric focus, and obviously that leads to a particular view. I hope her reasons don't have too much trauma behind them, but suspect they do.

Re: Diamonds Are Bullshit

#474

Post by utopkara » Wed, Mar 20, 2013, 7:37 AM UTC

kkshin wrote: post #251

I just went through the process of whether I would purchase a diamond engagement ring for my fiancee or not. Rationally, it made absolutely no sense to me for the following reasons: 1) The idea of "blood" diamonds as well as the fat that the industry marks up diamonds to a ridiculous notion without translating any of those benefits to the societies it exploits. 2) There is no tangible benefit to a diamond ring that C…

Don't refrain from buying because diamonds are hard to extract, and people have to work hard for it. But, because the whole trade is dirty, and you don't want to take part in it. All diamonds are dirty because of the conflict diamonds, there can be no non-conflict diamonds. By purchasing diamonds, you are helping to keep the prices up and funding the blood diamonds as well.

Re: Diamonds Are Bullshit

#475

Post by kamaal » Wed, Mar 20, 2013, 7:46 AM UTC

Goronmon wrote: post #408

astrodust wrote: post #401

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So the world is filled with gold-diggers? No. Not true. You'll find it shocking that in some parts of the world people are happily married without any jewelry at all.

I find it shocking that there are people that think that a woman wanting financial security makes that woman a 'gold-digger'.

>>I find it shocking that there are people that think that a woman wanting financial security makes that woman a 'gold-digger'.

Is it?

And why exactly is it the man's responsibility to provide financial security for the woman?

And I always thought women wanted equal rights. Its seems they only want a life long vacation at some body else's expense.

Re: Diamonds Are Bullshit

#476

Post by slavak » Wed, Mar 20, 2013, 7:49 AM UTC

enraged_camel wrote: post #304

maratd wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> so they just leave De Beers to run around gouging consumers That's kind of missing the point. If diamonds were 5 bucks a piece, women would no longer be interested in receiving rings bejeweled by them. A woman wants a man who is financially secure. If you can't afford a shiny rock, you can't afford what's coming after it either, so there's no point.

It doesn't have anything to do with financial security. Look, if your man is spending three months worth of salary on a piece of shiny rock, he is exercising poor financial judgment and that is a signal against future financial security. Women want diamonds not because of any symbolic reasons ("Diamonds are forever!") but because of reasons that are much more practical: they want to be able to show off the diamonds t…

> This is why many women will accept, at the rational level, that diamonds are horrible and stupid and even evil (since they fuel all kinds of violence in Africa, where they are mined). But most of them will not be able to bring themselves to accept substitutes such as sapphires, rubies, or emeralds. Because that would make their female friends think that the guy does not value them as much (or that they weren't able to find a guy who finds them worthy enough for a diamond).

This is, sadly, so very very true.

When I was proposing I wanted to get an alternative precious stone that would be actually rate - or, at least, a man-made diamond. I told my SO everything about how they're not rare, the price-fixing, the conflict diamonds - but she barely budged because of what her friends would think of it. I managed to sell the idea of a man-made diamond, but eventually had to settle for a natural one which wasn't sourced from Africa because of just how rare they are and how difficult it was to ship them to my country.

Re: Diamonds Are Bullshit

#477

Post by kaipakartik » Wed, Mar 20, 2013, 7:52 AM UTC

Its all about social status and peer pressure. Most marketing tends to revolve around this. Of course creating a need where there isn't any works as well.

Re: Diamonds Are Bullshit

#478

Post by maratd » Wed, Mar 20, 2013, 7:53 AM UTC

astrodust wrote: post #419

Goronmon wrote: post #408

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find it shocking that there are people that think that a woman wanting financial security makes that woman a 'gold-digger'.

There is an enormous difference between wanting financial security and wanting someone to buy them a giant diamond ring as a token of it.

No, there isn't. If the girl is even slightly intelligent, she will want proof of that financial security and a diamond ring is adequate proof that she can verify on her own.

Re: Diamonds Are Bullshit

#479

Post by slavak » Wed, Mar 20, 2013, 7:58 AM UTC

zecho wrote: post #406

enraged_camel wrote: post #304

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn't have anything to do with financial security. Look, if your man is spending three months worth of salary on a piece of shiny rock, he is exercising poor financial judgment and that is a signal against future financial security. Women want diamonds not because of any symbolic reasons ("Diamonds are forever!") but because of reasons that are much more practical: they want to be able to show off the diamonds t…

Out of curiosity, I started looking at what a three-months salary engagement ring would look like if I proposed to my wife today. Man am I lucky I got married right at the end of college and we purchased the engagement ring and wedding bands together to negotiate the price down, for far less money. I can't ever imagine my wife wearing rings like that. When we bought them, the sales lady told us we "can always upgrade…

Is the price of diamonds in the U.S. really that high?

I spent quite a chunk of change on an engagement ring for my fiancée, but it was closer to a week's salary. I think if I'd spent three months salary on it the rock would be so big she wouldn't be able to lift her hand.

I'm making good money, but we're not exactly talking Fortune-500 CEO levels here.

Re: Diamonds Are Bullshit

#480

Post by Helianthus » Wed, Mar 20, 2013, 8:06 AM UTC

ankeshk wrote: post #466

Helianthus wrote: post #461

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is the demand that I am unhappy with.

Being a minimalist myself, I know where you come from. Buying something expensive just to show others that you can buy something expensive seems like a ridiculous idea to me. But a big part of the world give a lot of importance to status and social standing. This is precisely the notion that has made money for companies like Rolex. And the haute couture fashion industry.

You must be a terrible minimalist. I don't think you actually are one.

Don't justify haute couture in a topic like this. It's terribly out of fashion.

Much later edit: I'll accept whatever downvotes are given me as long as I can say something about "Being a minimalist myself." Why did you even _assume_ that I associated myself with minimalism? My comment doesn't need to have any relevance as long as I can attack a person that attempts to pretend that _I_ want a pedigree that he thinks isn't a diamond.