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Stupid, Stupid xBox

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Re: Stupid, Stupid xBox

#161

Post by TylerE »

sk5t wrote: post #115
rhizome wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

RROD was much less of a problem than .jp sales, and much more easily fixed.

Y'know, it always seemed intuitively obvious to me that Japanese consumers would not be very receptive to any non-Japan-designed console unless it absolutely smashed the domestic offerings. One needn't chalk this up to xenophobia, but consider the advantage enjoyed by US domestic pickup truck manufacturers...

> but consider the advantage enjoyed by US domestic pickup truck manufacturers...

Look up the "chicken tax" sometime.

Re: Stupid, Stupid xBox

#162

Post by teamonkey »

adventured wrote: post #138
clobber wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nobody seems to remember just how much money Microsoft and Sony have lost on their consoles. - Through 2005, the Xbox gaming division had lost over $4 billion [1] - Microsoft took a charge of $1 billion dollars on its June 2007 income statement to account for the cost of replacing bricked Xbox 360s [1] - Xbox 360 and PS3 losses total $8 billion [2] Luckily for Microsoft, they've had the cash to burn to strong-arm the…

This is a very moot issue at this point. The $850+ million the Live division is now minting every quarter guarantees a strong profit base going forward for the Xbox. Their strategy worked brilliantly, and none of their competition has such a strong competitive advantage. Does it matter that it was expensive to acquire all those Live subscribers? No it does not. They made a huge bet on the future, and they had obscene…

Regarding Live's dominance, Microsoft cant afford to rest on that for much longer. Sony were playing catch-up for a long time but Playstation Plus is VERY competitive.

Live is based around mainly exclusionary practices - delaying demos, preventing you from playing multiplayer or using Netflix. PS+ on the other hand offers discounts and even free games (while you subscribe).

Re: Stupid, Stupid xBox

#163

Post by jamesmiller5 »

Kronopath wrote: post #75

This is a very revealing article: - It gives official confirmation of the (somewhat obvious) idea that the XBox was a defensive move against general living-room entertainment boxes. - It shows that he has a very distorted view of the gaming landscape, if the truly thinks that the XBox is the dominant platform, or that mobile games are a genuine threat to console gaming (they most certainly are not). - He singles out…

"- It shows that he has a very distorted view of the gaming landscape, if the truly thinks that the XBox is the dominant platform, or that mobile games are a genuine threat to console gaming (they most certainly are not)."

The threat of mobile gaming on the PC/Console gaming landscape has been recognized by some of the largest stars in the industry, eg: Gabe Newell states Valve wants the PC in the living room but the biggest competitor is Apple.

[1] Dice 2013 Keynote with Gabe Newell at 7:30 minutes in. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PeYxKIDGh8I

Re: Stupid, Stupid xBox

#164

Post by hollerith »

csense wrote: post #66
natbro wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

you're spot on, they shouldn't really cost anything. XCode for iOS development, for example, doesn't cost anything (once you've bought a mac). similarly Android development tools don't cost a thing. charging a small fee like $99/year for the apple developer program or the Amazon store, or $25/year (i think it is) for Google Play is something they say simply helps defray the costs of hosting your apps and icons and in…

I asked about this specifically because, when I got the book that really started me deep into programming [1], I was hampered by my lack of a C compiler and assembler, and the ~$200 cost thereof ($400 total, in mid-1990's dollars, for the two tools -- kids these days have it easy with binary downloads of Windows ports of gcc and NASM available free on the web). If I'd had that kind of money in middle school, I would…

>I don't think the DOS port of gcc, the Allegro system, was yet born

It might interest you to know that according to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DJGPP, there's been a DOS port of gcc since 1989.

Re: Stupid, Stupid xBox

#165

Post by roc »

ericd wrote: post #154
greggman wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not that I disagree but just so I can back myself up when I go repeat this to friends and colleagues where's the data to substantiate these claims? In particular that 360 has made more money for 3rd party devs than Wii. It doesn't really matter if Microsoft makes more money per gamer than Nintendo if Nintendo is still more popular. As a ludacris example I'd consider consider a company that sold a million $1 items mor…

According to wikipedia ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_video_game... ), there have been 618.24 million XBox 360 games sold, and 863.53 million Wii games sold as of December 31st 2012. Nintendo is bigger on the 1st party games, though, so who knows whether it's made more for 3rd party devs or not.

You also have to consider average selling price and DLC sales. Higher ASP + DLC could easily make a 360 version far more profitable for devs than a Wii version, even at half the units.

Re: Stupid, Stupid xBox

#166

Post by GotAnyMegadeth »

mwill wrote: post #124
InclinedPlane wrote: post #104

I see a couple comments here, including the highest voted top level comment, questioning how the xbox can be "crushing" their competition given that a straightforward reading of console sales indicates things aren't so cut and dried. However, the xbox is crushing its competition, in several ways, and let me explain why a naive reading of unit sales is misleading. Many consoles sell at a loss, especially initially, or…

Totally anecdotally, as cliche as it sounds I feel like what my parents (and other people who don't care about games) mistakingly call video games is a good indication of the current market. When I was a kid, every video game was "Nintendo" During the PSX/PS2 era, every video game was "Playstation" Now, every video game is "xbox" (Also a PSP is a "DS") I imagine they pick up the words unconsciously over time from TV/…

You've got to pick parents with the right level of awareness for this. My Mum is the same, but my Dad calls his phone a Gameboy, and refers to all other non-TV electronic devices we own as "The Machine".

Re: Stupid, Stupid xBox

#167

Post by jpxxx »

adventured wrote: post #140
jpxxx wrote: post #128

The console industry used to sell high-end wedding cakes. Now they sell wedding cakes, some sheet cakes, and occasionally a pre-boxed slice if there are leftovers. These are your only options for snacking in the living room. You order a wedding cake, go pick it up in a few days, and hope it tastes good. They are about to find out what happens when piping hot cookies are hand-delivered in 30 seconds or less to the liv…

None of that is going to happen. Apple is horrific at the gaming business, and that isn't going to change any time soon. Why? Because it's not a priority, and isn't going to be any time soon. The substantial infrastructure pieces that Microsoft, Sony and Nintendo have built up in gaming - Apple has none of that, and it isn't going to magically appear. Apple would have to make gaming a top priority, and they will neve…

How are they horrific at the gaming business when they're moving billions of games a year? And what infrastructure pieces are they missing?

GPU-rich devices installed and networked, check. Friends lists, check. Local multiplayer, check. Networked multiplayer, check. Distribution, check. Billing, check. In-app billing, check. DRM, check. Ad story, check. Developer program, check.

All they need is a controller if they want the living room.

Re: Stupid, Stupid xBox

#168

Post by jpxxx »

pfisch wrote: post #142
jpxxx wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, it'll be going for a vastly more lucrative market: everyone who is wildly overserved by the existing console market. Consoles had three decades to break out of niche and they failed. It's time for the final disruption of the living room.

These are two different markets that we are talking about. I don't think the goal of the xbox, ps3 or steam box ever has been to distribute a bunch of low budget $1 casual games. This is a potentially lucrative market, but it hasn't existed for 3 decades. I'm not even sure it has existed for 1. Changes in technology are only now making this possible, and tbh I hope all the console makers don't join this freemium casu…

The thing about $1 casual games is that they're now $0 casual games capable of drawing substantial income after the initial "sale".

Pre-paid boxed game software is not a growth industry, and post-paid digital is. It's not theoretical, this is happening now. It's not potentially lucrative, it's currently lucrative. The industry as a whole needs to adapt.

Re: Stupid, Stupid xBox

#169

Post by riffraff »

pandaman wrote: post #129
InclinedPlane wrote: post #104

I see a couple comments here, including the highest voted top level comment, questioning how the xbox can be "crushing" their competition given that a straightforward reading of console sales indicates things aren't so cut and dried. However, the xbox is crushing its competition, in several ways, and let me explain why a naive reading of unit sales is misleading. Many consoles sell at a loss, especially initially, or…

I am just curious - where are you getting the console costs from? From what I know this information is highly sensitive and even most insiders don't have an access. Also, what scale do you use to compare costs? From the fact that you call Kinect (sold ~18M [1]) "one of the most popular consumer electronic devices in history" and Move (sold ~15M[2]) "has not taken off" it appears that either you are using some kind of…

I have no idea on the concrete numbers, but the two sources you cite appear to be separated by almost one year (jan/2012 for the Kinect and nov/2012 for the Move one)

Re: Stupid, Stupid xBox

#170

Post by pandaman »

riffraff wrote: post #169
pandaman wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am just curious - where are you getting the console costs from? From what I know this information is highly sensitive and even most insiders don't have an access. Also, what scale do you use to compare costs? From the fact that you call Kinect (sold ~18M [1]) "one of the most popular consumer electronic devices in history" and Move (sold ~15M[2]) "has not taken off" it appears that either you are using some kind of…

I have no idea on the concrete numbers, but the two sources you cite appear to be separated by almost one year (jan/2012 for the Kinect and nov/2012 for the Move one)

Indeed, the sales figures are not synchronous. This is why I asked if GP has some special data, because the publically available one does not confirm his/her assertions.
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